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kb9vqf | MutantTurkey |
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* kb9vqf stays offline for now due to buggy webirc connection |
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kb9vqf | New logs at http://trinitydesktop.org/irc/logs_current.html |
kb9vqf | formatting is cleaner/easier to read |
kb9vqf | And best of all, tbottu shouldn't drop off the channel every week like before :) |
tbottu | 10mutantturkey@gmail.com changed the Component on bug 69 from system to ubuntu. |
tbottu | 04Bug http://bugs.pearsoncomputing.net/show_bug.cgi?id=69 normal, P5, ---, kb9vqf, UNCONFIRMED, Jaunty AMD64 LiveCD Boot Failure |
MutantTurkey | nice it works. |
MutantTurkey | kb9vqf: so we are all set for the whole bugwatch right? |
kb9vqf | I believe so... |
MutantTurkey | kb9vqf: lets hope i can clone this then... |
MutantTurkey | I rebooted my connection, still seems to cut out pretty fast |
kb9vqf | There are a lot of files there |
kb9vqf | I have noticed similar behaviour on my cell phone link as well |
MutantTurkey | hmmm it seemed that if i do ctrl+z (i forget what that does, freeze the program in midair i think) and then do fg it will start working agian. |
kb9vqf | (granted not with git, but just with normal downloads) |
MutantTurkey | kb9vqf: yes, this is my cell connection :P |
MutantTurkey | could i just download the raw files? |
MutantTurkey | clone onto my server, then wget the files :P |
MutantTurkey | kb9vqf: your connection also seems slow |
kb9vqf | I don't know if that will work |
MutantTurkey | i'll try it nonetheless. |
kb9vqf | would it be easier to send over the files you want uploaded in a tar file and I will commit them? |
MutantTurkey | lets see if this works then do that. |
kb9vqf | my connection may very well be slow :-P |
MutantTurkey | this is working so far. |
MutantTurkey | kb9vqf: okay this is not going to work |
MutantTurkey | I will tar it up. |
MutantTurkey | I do not have a way to email you however. |
MutantTurkey | can I pm you a link to my website of the tarball? |
kb9vqf | yews |
kb9vqf | *yes |
MutantTurkey | actually no idea how i can do that D: |
kb9vqf | well, it can wait I suppose |
MutantTurkey | because I am tethered i don't know my ip hrm hold up |
kb9vqf | when will you be on a better connection? |
MutantTurkey | tuesday |
kb9vqf | it can wait until then I would think :) |
MutantTurkey | ok :{ |
MutantTurkey | actually i'll see what i can do |
kb9vqf | it's up to you |
MutantTurkey | no go. |
MutantTurkey | I don't have any way to upload it. |
kb9vqf | It's OK |
kb9vqf | don't waste your time |
kb9vqf | I'll see you on Tuesday :) |
MutantTurkey | wait i think i have it |
MutantTurkey | nevermind again. |
kb9vqf | Like I said don't waste your time |
kb9vqf | Here's an idea |
kb9vqf | Do you think we could prioritize the bugs by difficulty? |
kb9vqf | I know the difficulty isn't set in stone, but simple malfunctions could probably be fixed first |
kb9vqf | (apparently simple that is) |
kb9vqf | if you want to go through the bugtracker and start making an Etherpad list of simple bugs I would appreciate it |
MutantTurkey | hmmm wait we can another boolean reight? |
MutantTurkey | i'll see what i can do |
kb9vqf | well I was just thinking a separate list on the Etherpad |
MutantTurkey | okay. |
MutantTurkey | we started that stuff |
kb9vqf | ordered by estimated difficulty, simplest ones on top |
MutantTurkey | okay. |
kb9vqf | I know and then it disappeared :( |
kb9vqf | But then again I remember it being pretty badly incomplete... |
MutantTurkey | i was starting a small list on the etherpad |
kb9vqf | I'll just say for the record that the first Etherpad installation was a test |
kb9vqf | I never expected it to be as good a tool as it was |
kb9vqf | so I wasn't very careful with it |
MutantTurkey | it really is |
MutantTurkey | okay i got my friend to email me the thing |
MutantTurkey | so i am shooting it to you |
kb9vqf | ok, thanks |
MutantTurkey | titled thingy |
MutantTurkey | my friend didn't understand it at all |
kb9vqf | got it |
kb9vqf | I'll throw it up on GIT |
MutantTurkey | great thanks |
MutantTurkey | as of right now i think it fails |
kb9vqf | MutantTurkey: That's OK; before you work on it more please check it out from GIT and keep updating it in GIT as you fix it :) |
kb9vqf | Also, about the arch/master/src directory |
kb9vqf | why are there tarballs in there? |
MutantTurkey | no idea what that is... |
MutantTurkey | oh |
kb9vqf | can I just delete it? |
MutantTurkey | sure |
kb9vqf | ok |
MutantTurkey | okay, going to look through bugs. |
kb9vqf | MutantTurkey: Uploaded |
kb9vqf | want the link? |
MutantTurkey | got it |
kb9vqf | ok |
kb9vqf | great |
MutantTurkey | easy bugs... hrm |
MutantTurkey | can't seem to find any hah |
MutantTurkey | so is the etherpad good to go for usage? |
kb9vqf | yes |
kb9vqf | it is stable |
MutantTurkey | passwords and such are the same? |
kb9vqf | and will be subject to scheduled backup now |
kb9vqf | I sent new invitations to you and Xu_R |
kb9vqf | oh wait, you don't have Email :-P |
MutantTurkey | yeah :P |
kb9vqf | hmmm |
kb9vqf | I don't know how to force it |
MutantTurkey | i might be able to do it on my phone |
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MutantTurkey | kb9vqf: are easy bugs also enhancements? |
MutantTurkey | there are some ones i see that are probably pretty simple |
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tbottu | 10mutantturkey@gmail.com changed the Component on bug 411 from kdelibs to ubuntu. |
tbottu | 04Bug http://bugs.pearsoncomputing.net/show_bug.cgi?id=411 major, P5, ---, kb9vqf, NEW, kdelibs4c2a-trinity "provides" missing to kdelibs4c2a |
tbottu | 10mutantturkey@gmail.com changed the Component on bug 376 from system to ubuntu. |
tbottu | 04Bug http://bugs.pearsoncomputing.net/show_bug.cgi?id=376 major, P5, ---, kb9vqf, NEW, Unable to install 10.10 over 9.04 |
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kb9vqf | sorry, webirc froze up on me again |
MutantTurkey | kb9vqf: i don't really see that many "easy easy" ones |
MutantTurkey | no kvirc? |
kb9vqf | if an enhancement is easy then feel free to add it |
kb9vqf | maybe the enhancements should be on a separate list |
MutantTurkey | yes |
kb9vqf | with that list being ordered as well from easy to hard |
MutantTurkey | also i think i am going to mark some more important |
kb9vqf | yes |
kb9vqf | maybe another list ordered by importance |
kb9vqf | bugzilla can do that |
MutantTurkey | i think some of those ubuntu are pretty critical |
kb9vqf | so fix the priority fields I guess :) |
MutantTurkey | yeah |
kb9vqf | I think all of the bugs are set to medium priority ATM |
kb9vqf | kvirc is in Trinity |
kb9vqf | must be an old bug |
MutantTurkey | no i meant, why are you using the webchat? |
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kb9vqf | I'm on a different computer right now |
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MutantTurkey | kb9vqf: alright bud. I am so tired i am unproductive. I'll talk to you tuesday when my internet is bacvk |
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kb9vqf | MutantTurkey: I'm on a different computer right now, so I don't have Konversation available |
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* Xu_R whistles as he reads the logs... oh damn, it actually extends past the buffer this time >_> |
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Space_Man | kb9vqf: is your power back? |
kb9vqf | YES! |
kb9vqf | As luck would have it the utility put us on the top of the list for restoration |
kb9vqf | (or pretty near it) |
kb9vqf | over 800,000 perople still are without power |
kb9vqf | *people |
kb9vqf | Xu_R|ZNC: Power's back way ahead of schedule |
kb9vqf | There is still a chance that portions of the electric grid could fail as power is restored to other customers AFAIK |
kb9vqf | so if I drop back offline please don't be alarmed |
kb9vqf | For anyone interested in a synopsis of the unusually strong weather at the Trinity web services location here's a graphic from a local TV station |
kb9vqf | http://blog.chicagoweathercenter.com/FEATGRAPH071211.jpg |
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Borg^Queen | gn |
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MutantTurkey | kb9vqf: having more connectivity issues? |
MutantTurkey | also anon.kde.org sucks. |
kb9vqf | Internet here is absolutely horrid |
kb9vqf | I got a helpful call from my ISP yesterday letting me know that they will be doing "major" maintinance in a few hours |
kb9vqf | "helpful" /sarcasm |
kb9vqf | Seems ol' Murphy is out to get me |
kb9vqf | My hunch is that their network was severely damaged yesterday by the storms |
kb9vqf | given that their call was about 6 hours later....we had registered 80MPH sustained(!) winds during the derecho event |
kb9vqf | Utility company called it "blitzkreig" :-P |
kb9vqf | *blitzkreig rather |
kb9vqf | We will need to get some kind of load balancing in place at some point in the future if this type of stuff becomes common place |
kb9vqf | Illinois is hurting for money as a whole and I suspect that some of the bad economy is eating into the utilities' preventative maintenance budgets |
MutantTurkey | there have been a whole array of storms lately |
MutantTurkey | still, doesn't give an excuse in my book for poor service. |
kb9vqf | you should see the pictures... |
kb9vqf | hang on, I'll put one on Imagebin :) |
MutantTurkey | I always give the "we are actually doing everything we can" not "we are doing everything we can/ |
MutantTurkey | at my job, as meanial as working as a 711 clerk... I seriously try to provided maximum service and take into account the entire store at once. |
MutantTurkey | so when companies tell me "they are doing everything they can" while i am watching their maintenance crews are sitting outside my sev eating and carrying on for a good part of the hour on thier clock... |
MutantTurkey | anyway. I digress. I am entirely fed up with my lousy service. my router has not shown up yet. |
kb9vqf | hehe |
kb9vqf | one sec while I get the link... |
kb9vqf | well, at my speeds right now, maybe more like a minute :-P |
MutantTurkey | i'm rocking off of 3g, so it'll take about a week to download |
kb9vqf | :-P |
kb9vqf | after the storms my camera and I went around documenting the damage |
MutantTurkey | that impressive? huh. |
MutantTurkey | no household damage i hope. |
kb9vqf | trees everywhere |
kb9vqf | yes, some fell on houses |
kb9vqf | and cars |
kb9vqf | some of the wires just snapped from the wind alone |
MutantTurkey | yeah. weirdly enough my neighbor has had 4/5 tree fall in like 3 years. |
kb9vqf | the corn fields were *flattened* |
kb9vqf | if my connection were better I'd upload a few pics |
MutantTurkey | last year it came across the street, onto the wires in front of my house, and as just leaning on the wire. |
MutantTurkey | they roped it off with caution tape and left it hanging for a few days. |
kb9vqf | :eek: |
MutantTurkey | :| |
* kb9vqf wonders if he sent a 64x64 pixel thumbnail if *that* might make it through :-P |
kb9vqf | Oh and it's also fun to have the lights flickering all day |
kb9vqf | probably as portions of the grid are switched back in |
kb9vqf | MutantTurkey: http://imagebin.org/162840 |
MutantTurkey | makes sense. |
kb9vqf | damage in a residential area |
MutantTurkey | ouch. that's not pretty. |
kb9vqf | No kidding |
kb9vqf | I have more pics from elsewhere |
MutantTurkey | one thing i always wondered (besides the topic) |
kb9vqf | Try a huge iron Farm&Fleet sign bent to the ground |
MutantTurkey | is why the H-E-double hocky sticks do all word processors lack tabbing features? it's ridiculous. |
MutantTurkey | kb9vqf: I am glad i live on the east coast. as i say "it's boring and everything about NJ sucks. but hey, we don't get natural disasters" |
kb9vqf | except the "Perfect Storm" of '92 |
kb9vqf | IIRC that hit the entire East coast |
MutantTurkey | also in like 98 |
MutantTurkey | mostly our issues are minor flooding but that is about it. |
kb9vqf | s/1992/1991/g |
kb9vqf | :) |
* kb9vqf sometimes gets dates slightly off |
kb9vqf | This has certainly been a year for extremes |
MutantTurkey | I am awful enough with dates as is. |
kb9vqf | The south gets record tornadoes and then broils |
kb9vqf | Texas is in record drought |
MutantTurkey | global warming eh? |
kb9vqf | hehe |
kb9vqf | Actually this is not all that abnormal |
MutantTurkey | actually not at all. but more like "the built up 150 years of environmental distruction. |
kb9vqf | People forget that the weather is an average |
MutantTurkey | global warming doesn't exist. |
kb9vqf | right |
MutantTurkey | but the reasons for katrina, flooding and such |
MutantTurkey | is all because we destroy our natural barriers. |
kb9vqf | are statistical likelihoods |
kb9vqf | take my area for instance |
kb9vqf | we have not had a tornado for many decades |
kb9vqf | yet on average we should have one every decade or so |
kb9vqf | (a big one that is) |
kb9vqf | so people get complacent and when the statistics finally catch up with them things get ugly |
kb9vqf | Just my $0.02 ;-) |
MutantTurkey | oddly, we have had a few in philly in the past few years. |
MutantTurkey | actually one touched down in my suburb, while i was in middle school. |
kb9vqf | :eek: |
kb9vqf | There was one back in the 60s here that completely destroyed a middle school in my general area |
kb9vqf | They are nothing to mess with |
kb9vqf | we still have a strict building code as a result |
MutantTurkey | which is good. |
kb9vqf | yes |
MutantTurkey | all buildings in the midwest are brick right? |
kb9vqf | No, surprisingly |
MutantTurkey | all of ours are crappy and thrown together with wood and glue. |
MutantTurkey | really? I've been to more of the missouri area |
MutantTurkey | mostly brick their |
kb9vqf | but near major tornado touchdowns they do require reinforced roofs and such |
MutantTurkey | kb9vqf: in comparison. there are none hear, and only brick ones are the historical ones. |
kb9vqf | here they are McMansions with brick facades and cheap vinyl siding on the sides and rear |
kb9vqf | They look REALLY unsafe if a tornado hit :-P |
MutantTurkey | basically. |
kb9vqf | nothing like bricks flying through your siding and foam insulation... |
kb9vqf | anyway I think I am far enough OT for the time being :) |
kb9vqf | Hopefully my power and ISP connection will stabilise in the next few days |
kb9vqf | None of us has the resources to be another Google and distribute services over a dedicated fiber line |
kb9vqf | Same goes for your VPS |
kb9vqf | if a severe event hit the datacenter you'd be down too ;-) |
MutantTurkey | what about it? |
MutantTurkey | except that they have 3 data centers! :D |
MutantTurkey | (i think at least) |
kb9vqf | And they are all in sync? |
MutantTurkey | not sure, I will ask now. |
kb9vqf | That kind of technology has not been developed yet |
kb9vqf | it would require insane bandwidth AFAIK |
MutantTurkey | they have it. |
MutantTurkey | it's in germany |
MutantTurkey | I dont know how that is for weather. |
kb9vqf | I would be very surprised if your VPS has transparent failover between datacenters |
kb9vqf | Germany is very stable weather-wise |
kb9vqf | Nothing of interest |
kb9vqf | the mountains tend to destroy convective structures |
kb9vqf | While tornadoes are not unheard of there, it is nothing like the Midwest of the United States ;-) |
kb9vqf | This connection is driving me nuts, so I'll sign off for now |
kb9vqf | Thanks for the chat |
MutantTurkey | yep |
MutantTurkey | I'll be around tomorrow working hours if you want to do more admin related bug work. |
kb9vqf | ok, sounds good |
kb9vqf | I just got done tracing more memory corruption in kdesktop |
kb9vqf | fixes are in SVN |
MutantTurkey | excellent. |
kb9vqf | and tbottu isn't dying, even though the connection is horrid :) |
MutantTurkey | Tomorrow i am going to track down that problem of building on arch, hopefully get that sorted out. |
kb9vqf | So that is a major improvement |
kb9vqf | Sounds good |
kb9vqf | samelian was here not that long ago |
MutantTurkey | tbottu seems a bit more stable lately. |
tbottu | MutantTurkey: Error: "seems" is not a valid command. |
MutantTurkey | :P |
MutantTurkey | kb9vqf: me and samelian seem to keep missing eachother. |
kb9vqf | yeah |
kb9vqf | I can't help too much |
kb9vqf | (mainly because it works on my systems) |
MutantTurkey | we need samelian, he understands cmake :) |
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kb9vqf | DNS changes are propogating through the Internet as I type this |
kb9vqf | Expect all services to be restored in about 24 hours |
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Xu_R | i spy a kb9vqf and a tbottu |
Xu_R | :o |
kb9vqf | :) |
Xu_R | servers connected now? :D |
kb9vqf | No guaruntees that everything is fully online yet, but from what I can see everything is.... |
kb9vqf | if you see something down/unavailable please poke me |
Xu_R | I see it online :D |
kb9vqf | :) |
Xu_R | :D |
kb9vqf | Some info is on the Etherpad |
kb9vqf | the last problem was that my ISP cut a fiber cable :-P |
Space_Man | lol |
kb9vqf | so we should probably have a meeting in a week or two |
Xu_R | it's supposed to be tuesday... |
kb9vqf | hmmm, ok |
kb9vqf | I don't know how much progress others made, but obviously I wasn't able to do what I wanted to yet |
Xu_R | ok, I may postpone it. |
kb9vqf | specifically I am still waiting on a full Qt3/Qt4 rebuild of the latest Trinity SVN |
kb9vqf | no power and no Internet made that all but impossible |
Xu_R | oh. that's almost guaranting it |
Xu_R | *guaranteeing (or however you spell it) |
kb9vqf | yep, that's right |
kb9vqf | I'll check back later...if anyone sees any services down please poke me |
kb9vqf | gotta get the build farm running that build again.... |
MutantTurkey | o/ |
MutantTurkey | they! |
MutantTurkey | hey' |
MutantTurkey | kb9vqf: tim i got backups working of kde.org |
MutantTurkey | kb9vqf: http://mutantturkey.com/mirrorlog.html |
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Borg^Queen | hi hi |
MutantTurkey | hey |
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Piki | hi |
Piki | yay, the sites back! :-) |
kb9vqf | And ahead of schedule too :) |
kb9vqf | See the July meeting etherpad for more info on the outages |
Piki | btw what version of autotools did 3.5.12 need? |
kb9vqf | autoconf 2.63 IIRC |
kb9vqf | <= 2.63 |
Piki | i'm just about ready to start building, i just need to grab autotools and start building |
Piki | kb9vqf: is a certain version of automake required? |
kb9vqf | no |
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Piki | the qt tarball i need is qt-x11-free-3.3.8b.tar.xx ? |
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MutantTurkey | kb9vqf: hey, future comment about the channel |
MutantTurkey | when you have an outage, update the topic so people know :) |
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MutantTurkey | samelian: hey I need some help building kdebase |
MutantTurkey | I am having trouble making it find the dbus tqt path i think |
MutantTurkey | I tried adding it to my CMAKE_INCLUDE_PATH but it still doesn't see it. |
samelian | what kind of trouble? |
MutantTurkey | it gives me the dbus-tqt cannot be found on your system |
MutantTurkey | but i exported it with export CMAKE_INCLUDE_PATH=/opt/qt/include/tqt:/opt/trinity/include/dbus-1.0:/opt/trinity/include/dbus-1.0/dbus:/opt/trinity/include:/opt/trinity/include/libkrandr |
samelian | check error log |
MutantTurkey | http://ix.io/1Nk |
MutantTurkey | It doesn't seem to include it |
samelian | where is located your connection.h? |
MutantTurkey | /opt/trinity/include |
samelian | in /opt/trinity/include/dbus/connection.h ? |
MutantTurkey | /opt/trinity/include/dbus-1.0/dbus/ |
samelian | where is dbus-tqt.pc? |
MutantTurkey | in uh |
MutantTurkey | /opt/trinity/lib/pkgconfig |
samelian | and cmake knows that .pc file is located in /opt/trinity/lib/pkgconfig? |
MutantTurkey | export PKG_CONFIG_PATH=:/opt/trinity/lib/pkgconfig:/opt/qt/lib/pkgconfig: |
samelian | show me output of pkg-config --cflags dbus-tqt |
MutantTurkey | -I/opt/trinity/include |
samelian | but pkg-config --cflags dbus-1-tqt ? |
MutantTurkey | nope |
samelian | hmm, seems that kdebase cmake is not adapted for dbus-1-tqt |
MutantTurkey | ah |
samelian | try to replace pkg_search_module( DBUS dbus-1 ) |
samelian | with pkg_search_module( DBUS dbus-tqt ) |
MutantTurkey | where is that? |
samelian | ConfigureChecks.cmake |
MutantTurkey | oh in CMrighright |
MutantTurkey | still errors out |
MutantTurkey | maybe dbus-tqt-1 |
samelian | I don't think so, dbus/connection.h is provided by dbus-tqt |
MutantTurkey | hrm |
samelian | MutantTurkey: you have pkg_search_module( DBUS dbus-tqt ), of smth else? |
MutantTurkey | i have dbus-tqt |
samelian | I see, but the variable is DBUS, or smth else? |
MutantTurkey | i have that |
samelian | paste entire ConfigureChecks |
MutantTurkey | ok |
MutantTurkey | http://ix.io/1N1 |
MutantTurkey | http://ix.io/1Nl |
MutantTurkey | i apologize |
MutantTurkey | they look the same xD |
samelian | the error is the same? |
MutantTurkey | let me retry |
samelian | show me output of cmake as well |
MutantTurkey | http://ix.io/1Nm |
samelian | and error log/ |
MutantTurkey | OK |
MutantTurkey | http://ix.io/1Nn |
samelian | hmm |
samelian | are you sure you have /opt/trinity/include/dbus? |
MutantTurkey | let me verify |
MutantTurkey | no not there |
MutantTurkey | there is |
samelian | but? |
MutantTurkey | /opt/trinity/include/dbus-1.0/ |
samelian | should be in /opt/trinity/include/dbus |
MutantTurkey | okay i wonder why it is in dbus-1.0 |
MutantTurkey | it should be in dbus-1.0 |
MutantTurkey | that is where it installs default |
MutantTurkey | do you want me to move it? |
MutantTurkey | either way, i included /opt/trinity/include/dbus-1.0/ |
samelian | dbus should be installed where .pc file indicate |
samelian | otherwise can't be found |
MutantTurkey | samelian: I'll look at the pc file |
MutantTurkey | isn't the pc file generated? |
samelian | it is |
kb9vqf | Good idea MutantTurkey :) |
MutantTurkey | kb9vqf: yeah. |
MutantTurkey | samelian: hrm no luck then |
MutantTurkey | can i regenerate it or something/ |
samelian | .pc file is based on INCLUDE_INSTALL_DIR |
MutantTurkey | okay |
MutantTurkey | kb9vqf: do you know why it would be in "dbus-1.0" instead of dbus? |
MutantTurkey | samelian: okay |
MutantTurkey | for tqt |
kb9vqf | I don't know; I haven't looked at that code in quite a while :-/ |
samelian | how you installed dbus-tqt? |
MutantTurkey | samelian: what do you mean? |
samelian | is installed by make install or somehow manually? |
MutantTurkey | with my pkgbuild |
MutantTurkey | its packaged |
samelian | aha |
MutantTurkey | my INCLUDE_INSTALL_DIR is /opt/trinity |
samelian | maybe your package did not respect CMAKE_PREFIX |
MutantTurkey | ? |
samelian | ah, I see a problem |
samelian | install( FILES |
samelian | dbus-qt.h message.h connection.h server.h |
samelian | DESTINATION ${INCLUDE_INSTALL_DIR}/dbus-1.0/dbus ) |
samelian | i'm not sure why is that |
samelian | kb9vqf: you did not changed DESTINATION? |
samelian | I don't remember if I changed it |
kb9vqf | I don't remember either |
samelian | hehe |
kb9vqf | all I know is it works here (TM) |
kb9vqf | :) |
samelian | ok, I will check it today later |
kb9vqf | thanks |
samelian | right now my mind is too fuzzy, there is 7:00 AM at this moment :) |
kb9vqf | I'm currently in the middle of a rebuild that was interrupted due to Monday's derecho |
samelian | I can't sleep |
MutantTurkey | I am up :D |
MutantTurkey | so I am at this point, just waiting for that file change? |
MutantTurkey | i'll just do it myself |
MutantTurkey | kb9vqf: wait should it be ${INCLUDE_INSTALL_DIR}/dbus/? |
MutantTurkey | kb9vqf: can anyone clone the git? |
MutantTurkey | anyway actually i am going to sleep. I'll sort this out later. |
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MutantTurkey | samelian: so any idea about this problem i am having? |
MutantTurkey | kb9vqf: how do i clone our git? :\ |
MutantTurkey | without a user |
MutantTurkey | just no user prefixing the url/ |
MutantTurkey | ? |
Xu_R | MutantTurkey: remove your username from it |
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MutantTurkey | Xu_R: okay yeah i am just going t odo that |
MutantTurkey | gotta convert all the package building systems to git D: |
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MutantTurkey | kb9vqf: hey important |
MutantTurkey | kb9vqf: on the archlinux developers mailing list |
MutantTurkey | they are discussing who isgoing to maintain qt3 and kdelibs3 |
MutantTurkey | i privately emailed the guy earier about qt3 |
MutantTurkey | but kdelibs3 is a different story |
MutantTurkey | http://mailman.archlinux.org/pipermail/arch-dev-public/2011-July/020985.html |
MutantTurkey | are we compat with the old kde3libs? i am not suree how this works |
MutantTurkey | but, this could be our foot in the door to getting supported officially by a distro |
MutantTurkey | Xu_R|ZNC: ^ also see this and tell me what you tink |
kb9vqf | We are NOT compatible with the old kdelibs in terms of the ABI |
kb9vqf | the API will allow the older KDE3 apps to be compiled against the Trinity kdelibs in theory, but I've never tried it |
kb9vqf | the fact that we use TQt instead of Qt3 may throw a monkey wrench into that idea |
MutantTurkey | yeah. |
ar | kb9vqf: TQt is the wrapper around qt4? |
MutantTurkey | but qt3 is api compat right? |
MutantTurkey | ar: yes and qt3 |
MutantTurkey | against all qt versions |
kb9vqf | yes, qt3 is compatible |
MutantTurkey | kb9vqf: because we could be qt3 upstream |
kb9vqf | that is OK with me |
MutantTurkey | kb9vqf: so in theory we could compile to the, but not neccesarily? |
kb9vqf | The goal is to pull all of the disparate Qt3 patches to create a central, up-to-date Qt3 repository that can then be extended as neccessary |
MutantTurkey | yes |
kb9vqf | "compile to the"? |
MutantTurkey | if they recompile (thats probably okay) will it work? |
MutantTurkey | recompile gaainst new kde3libs |
kb9vqf | possibly |
kb9vqf | I can't guarantee it |
kb9vqf | the reason is that some member names changed in TQt3 |
kb9vqf | In all likelihood the original Qt3 member names will "bleed through" and the code will compile, but I am not comfortable stating that it *will* work at this point |
MutantTurkey | ok |
MutantTurkey | i am recommending they don't use our kdelibs3 |
MutantTurkey | did you see that link |
MutantTurkey | ? |
kb9vqf | looking at it now |
kb9vqf | can they try it? |
MutantTurkey | i emailed it |
MutantTurkey | to you |
kb9vqf | ok |
MutantTurkey | my response |
MutantTurkey | look at it and see if it's okay |
kb9vqf | I'm just not sure what to do here :) |
kb9vqf | we're not stable yet |
kb9vqf | (will be fall before 3.5.13 is released) |
kb9vqf | Just a couple of nits |
kb9vqf | 1.) TQt is not Tqt ;-) |
kb9vqf | 2.) kde3 is not Trinity |
MutantTurkey | i know. |
MutantTurkey | thats what i mean |
kb9vqf | 3.) I would put in a recommendation that they look into switching to the Trinity-provided kdelibs/kdebase/kde* modules |
kb9vqf | just for the simple fact that they are having build problems now with the old stock KDE3 sources |
kb9vqf | Just a thought |
MutantTurkey | so i should recommend that when we release stable, they should just switch? |
kb9vqf | it won't be as easy as "just switch", primarily due to CMake being used to build arts/kdelibs/kdebase, but yes |
kb9vqf | it shouldn't be too bad |
kb9vqf | I changed the Ubuntu build scripts in about a day |
kb9vqf | (to handle CMake and the tqtinterface deps that is) |
MutantTurkey | but if i have package builds they can just steam them |
MutantTurkey | because i would pu the mup for them to steal :0 |
kb9vqf | ah, ok :) |
kb9vqf | yes, in that case switching would be easy |
MutantTurkey | read that |
MutantTurkey | sent another |
MutantTurkey | kb9vqf: i think that should be the one i send off, unless there is any other problems? |
kb9vqf | Looks good |
kb9vqf | I only have one suggestion |
MutantTurkey | yes? |
kb9vqf | The Qt3 repository is actually ready to use, combining all the patches I am aware of |
MutantTurkey | okay so they should use it? |
MutantTurkey | what is the link? |
kb9vqf | I would say yes |
kb9vqf | http://git.trinitydesktop.org/viewgit/index.php?a=tree&p=Trinity%20Desktop%20Environment&hb=HEAD&f=main/dependencies/qt3 |
kb9vqf | that's the Webgit |
kb9vqf | an actual checkout command would be: |
kb9vqf | git clone http://scm.trinitydesktop.org/scm/git/tde/main/dependencies/qt3 |
kb9vqf | or there's a handy .tar.gz link on the bottom of the webgit page ;-) |
kb9vqf | As more patches are applied they will be listed in the changes-3.3.8d file |
MutantTurkey | ok |
kb9vqf | If there are any compilation issues they should just poke me here or send an Email to the trinity-devel list |
kb9vqf | IIRC a compilation test was already run successfully on an non-Ubuntu system by someone on the mailing list |
kb9vqf | so I'm not expecting any problems |
MutantTurkey | http://mailman.archlinux.org/pipermail/arch-general/2011-July/020969.html sent |
MutantTurkey | gottta go drop off paper work at HR |
kb9vqf | ok, thanks |
MutantTurkey | i'll stop by later. |
kb9vqf | sure |
kb9vqf | hopefully we start getting some downstream distro support now... :) |
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Borg^Queen | hello humans, AIs and others |
MutantTurkey | blech |
Borg^Queen | ? |
MutantTurkey | running around hot downtown filling out paperwork |
MutantTurkey | very gross |
Borg^Queen | ugh really, how hot is it? |
Borg^Queen | its 35c here |
MutantTurkey | uh i would say about 35c |
MutantTurkey | which by itself is bearable |
MutantTurkey | but the humidity |
MutantTurkey | is terrible. |
Borg^Queen | the tell is, if you believe the weather monkeys, its going to get up about 38c here today |
Borg^Queen | I doubt it, since its already cooling off |
Borg^Queen | I hate humidity, makes for a bad hair day, and mine is very long |
Borg^Queen | I end up looking like a rabid brillo pad |
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Borg^Queen | hi kb9vqf |
kb9vqf | Hello :) |
Borg^Queen | Got some feed back from my testers yesterday |
Borg^Queen | "Great job! |
Borg^Queen | " |
kb9vqf | :D |
Borg^Queen | That was pretty much it, they went back to using it |
kb9vqf | VERY glad to hear that! |
Borg^Queen | T he only complaints where about in ubuntu in general |
Borg^Queen | Its a well earned feed back |
kb9vqf | Yes, Ubuntu is fast becoming a steaming pile of something nasty :-P |
Borg^Queen | ooh lol |
kb9vqf | Too unstable, too much API breakage for no reason |
kb9vqf | Case in point: I do video editing in my spare time |
kb9vqf | and use IEEE1394 |
kb9vqf | Guess what Natty did? |
Borg^Queen | Its called "Replicate Fade" a genetics term, meaning errors resulting from making copies of copies |
kb9vqf | They moved the /dev/raw1394 device to /dev/fw0....for no reason whatsoever! |
Borg^Queen | Umm I use fW too |
Borg^Queen | arrrgh |
Borg^Queen | seriously? |
kb9vqf | Let's just say it breaks Kino and other apps |
kb9vqf | and yes :-P |
kb9vqf | I am serious |
Borg^Queen | Well I do my video editing, which is a lot, on Ark linux, which sadly doesn't have TDE yet. But the founding devel is very interested. Come to #arklinux to meet him if you have the time and inclination. |
kb9vqf | A symbolic link will fix the issue (ln -s /dev/fw0 /dev/raw1394), but you have to do that on every boot |
kb9vqf | Debian is starting to look more and more attractive |
kb9vqf | I have Debian boxes that give me no trouble whatsoever |
Borg^Queen | I was on debian but I wanted a pure kde distro, arklinux was and still is the best distro I've used. I have it so tweaked I can do 80% of my work from konq |
Borg^Queen | I have video, audio, graphics, file management and more servicemenus |
kb9vqf | nice |
Borg^Queen | I've been experimenting with dvd, bluray ripping and converting to mkv |
Borg^Queen | the cli tools are SO easy |
kb9vqf | You're lucky you aren't in the USA |
* kb9vqf wishes he could do that |
Borg^Queen | I am |
kb9vqf | BTW can you check the rsync mirror of Trinity for me? |
Borg^Queen | how |
kb9vqf | see if you can get a directory list from rsync.trinitydesktop.org |
kb9vqf | e.g. with rsync rsync://rsync.trinitydesktop.org |
* kb9vqf is fixing some routing issues |
Borg^Queen | ok hang on, don't use rsync very often |
Borg^Queen | rsync: getaddrinfo: rsync.trinitydesktop.org 873: Name or service not known |
Borg^Queen | rsync error: error in socket IO (code 10) at clientserver.c(122) [receiver=3.0.2] |
Borg^Queen | kb9vqf: you can add all kinds of multimedia services because you are not a commercial entity |
* kb9vqf was afraid of that |
kb9vqf | hang on |
* kb9vqf mutters something about keeping illegal topics off this channel |
kb9vqf | :) |
Borg^Queen | aye |
kb9vqf | OK, please try the rsync again... |
Borg^Queen | one moment |
Borg^Queen | same error |
Borg^Queen | perhaps I'm getting the command wrong |
kb9vqf | ok |
kb9vqf | no |
kb9vqf | I was playing with the routing and messed it up |
Borg^Queen | give me an exact command |
Borg^Queen | I did that last night took down my entire network until 10 am this morning |
kb9vqf | Borg^Queen: OK, try one more time |
kb9vqf | rsync rsync://rsync.trinitydesktop.org |
Borg^Queen | same error |
kb9vqf | ?? |
kb9vqf | That should have worked |
kb9vqf | what is the error? |
Borg^Queen | the way I do it is I open a terminal into the dir where I have the iso, is that wrong? |
Borg^Queen | rsync: getaddrinfo: rsync.trinitydesktop.org 873: Name or service not known |
Borg^Queen | rsync error: error in socket IO (code 10) at clientserver.c(122) [receiver=3.0.2] |
kb9vqf | Sounds like a DNS malfunction |
kb9vqf | What does ping rsync.trinitydesktop.org show? |
Borg^Queen | one moment |
Borg^Queen | ping: unknown host rsync.trinitydesktop.org |
Borg^Queen | let me test me ping functions |
Borg^Queen | its working |
kb9vqf | hmmm |
kb9vqf | I will have to think for a few minutes |
Borg^Queen | sorry |
kb9vqf | Borg^Queen: OK, try again please... |
Borg^Queen | ok |
Borg^Queen | same both rsync and ping |
kb9vqf | rsync still failing? |
Borg^Queen | is trinity site down? |
Borg^Queen | yes on rsync and ping as well |
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Borg^Queen | There goes the neihbourhood |
kb9vqf | Ah, there we go I think |
Borg^Queen | There goes the neighborhood even |
Borg^Queen | check? |
kb9vqf | yes |
kb9vqf | I confused it with two gateways :-P |
kb9vqf | (accidentally) |
Borg^Queen | not working |
Borg^Queen | maybe I'm doing something wrong? |
kb9vqf | worked on a remote system I have access to |
kb9vqf | hmmm |
kb9vqf | post the command? |
Borg^Queen | ping rsync.trinitydesktop.org & ping rsync.trinitydesktop.org are the commands I'm using |
kb9vqf | Oh, ping may not work |
kb9vqf | I was just making sure it resolved the DNS entry |
kb9vqf | in fact IIRC ping is blocked |
kb9vqf | what about rsync? |
Xu_R | shush Borg^Queen. :P |
Borg^Queen | same error as before |
kb9vqf | Xu_R: Can you try? |
Xu_R | kb9vqf: http://forum.mandriva.com/en/viewtopic.php?f=181&t=128274&p=848036#p848036 have you seen this? |
kb9vqf | rsync rsync://rsync.trinitydesktop.org |
Borg^Queen | same |
Xu_R | nope |
Xu_R | doesn't work here |
kb9vqf | failing? |
kb9vqf | hmmm |
kb9vqf | oh, duh |
kb9vqf | I gave the wrong URL |
kb9vqf | sorry |
* kb9vqf needs more coffee |
Borg^Queen | >: |
Xu_R | xD |
Borg^Queen | lol |
Borg^Queen | ok brb |
kb9vqf | rsync rsync://rsync.pearsoncomputing.net |
MutantTurkey | what's up with rsync? |
kb9vqf | The mirroring system broke after the IP change |
Borg^Queen | ok working |
Xu_R | there we go |
MutantTurkey | oh D: |
Xu_R | that works xD |
Borg^Queen | brb |
kb9vqf | So the mirrors should sync again...that's good |
kb9vqf | Xu_R: Can you try another test for me? |
Xu_R | sure |
kb9vqf | Try to actually *pull* some files from that rsync server |
kb9vqf | I need to make sure the bandwidth settings are OK |
kb9vqf | Let me know when you have initiated the download so I can peer at the charts |
Xu_R | ok |
kb9vqf | it's active? |
MutantTurkey | kb9vqf: sent that email off, still no word back yet no idea why. |
kb9vqf | give them time :) |
MutantTurkey | indeed |
kb9vqf | Xu_R: Not seeing your download traffic yet |
Xu_R | yea, hold on |
Xu_R | router's been screwing me up all weekend |
kb9vqf | oh, ok |
kb9vqf | I just need a short burst for a minute or so |
Borg^Queen | ok back |
Xu_R | got that short burst? |
kb9vqf | no |
kb9vqf | I was waiting for a poke |
kb9vqf | sorry |
kb9vqf | try again? |
Xu_R | get anything? |
Xu_R | because my server is seeing yours and pulling now |
kb9vqf | yes, I see your traffic |
kb9vqf | It's in the wrong spot on my end |
kb9vqf | hang on while I reconfigure something |
Xu_R | ok |
Xu_R | stopping and waiting |
kb9vqf | Xu_R: Try again please |
Xu_R | starting |
kb9vqf | OK, much better |
kb9vqf | everything looks OK now |
Xu_R | ok |
kb9vqf | thanks |
Xu_R | terminating |
kb9vqf | BTW please don't use that address unless you have a mirror to add to the system |
Xu_R | kb9vqf: ok. i'm not using it anyway. |
kb9vqf | When the primary mirrors start pulling that link will swamp very quickly :) |
Xu_R | xD I figured |
Xu_R | kb9vqf: so did you see this? http://forum.mandriva.com/en/viewtopic.php?f=181&t=128274&p=848036#p848036 |
Borg^Queen | I leave the mirrors to the pros |
kb9vqf | Xu_R: yes I did |
Borg^Queen | Xu_R: I read it, what about it? |
kb9vqf | so it looks like there are spec files "out there in the Ether"? |
kb9vqf | want to pull them and try building Trinity with them? (hint hint) |
Xu_R | kb9vqf: yea... I want to see what he did |
Xu_R | except I need to see if that fix can be used to build the latest SVN too. |
kb9vqf | If they're good clone them to our GIT repo |
Xu_R | Borg^Queen: that is supposed to allow the old autotools system to build Trinity |
Xu_R | with newer autoconf versions |
Borg^Queen | I thought we were going to all cmake |
Borg^Queen | I hate autotools |
Xu_R | Borg^Queen: we're not stalled on it anymore, so if you can still use it, it's an advantage to have a fallback |
Borg^Queen | true, good point |
Xu_R | I haven't heard from anyone on the July Meeting except kb9vqf... *glare* |
kb9vqf | Xu_R: I patched Automake as best as I could some time ago |
kb9vqf | i.e. most things build |
kb9vqf | arts is NOT one of them |
kb9vqf | but since we have CMake for Arts I don't really care |
Borg^Queen | does arts do anything anymore? |
kb9vqf | yes |
kb9vqf | it's still needed |
kb9vqf | it does seem quite stable IMHO |
kb9vqf | I have had no problems with it since 3.5.11 |
Xu_R | ok |
Borg^Queen | I never had any problems with it, but everyone says its been replaced |
Borg^Queen | ? |
kb9vqf | with what? |
kb9vqf | pulseaudio? |
kb9vqf | that *does* give me problems on a near-daily asis |
kb9vqf | *basis |
kb9vqf | AFAIK there is no viable replacement for arts |
Borg^Queen | I never got it to work, and phonon keeps crashing |
kb9vqf | I think the "arts is dead" stuff is wishful thinking |
Borg^Queen | A lot of kde4 is wishful thinking, honestly |
kb9vqf | as in it was replaced under KDE4 with an unstable chunk of new software |
kb9vqf | :) |
Borg^Queen | case in point |
Xu_R | lol |
Borg^Queen | what lol its true |
Xu_R | I know |
MutantTurkey | yes! finally got all my paperwork done with the HR department :) |
Xu_R | MutantTurkey: :D |
MutantTurkey | :D :D |
MutantTurkey | but now i actually have to work D: |
Borg^Queen | lol |
Xu_R | hey, kb9vqf: could you give Borg^Queen git access? I want her to help me with packaging for RPM-based distros |
kb9vqf | sure :) |
Borg^Queen | I stink at that |
kb9vqf | Can I have a real name and an Email address? |
Xu_R | Borg^Queen: even if it's testing...? lol |
Borg^Queen | Kate Draven / borgqueen4@gmail.com |
MutantTurkey | SSN and phone number and bank #'s to |
MutantTurkey | :p |
kb9vqf | OK |
kb9vqf | No |
Xu_R | LOL |
Borg^Queen | Oh I can test, I can break and complain about anything |
Borg^Queen | what |
Xu_R | as you are notorious for doing that ;P |
Borg^Queen | MutantTurkey: >: |
MutantTurkey | kb9vqf: is it possible that we could have some sort of developers area for the site? as a portal |
kb9vqf | Remember we are a desktop project, meaning that we should at least know who is committing what for security reasons |
Borg^Queen | true |
Xu_R | kb9vqf: and for good reasons too. |
MutantTurkey | i mean just like a page that links to all the other ones |
Borg^Queen | kb9vqf: I' |
MutantTurkey | because we have cgit, etherpad, etc |
Borg^Queen | I'm glad you said that |
Xu_R | speaking of Etherpad, is the July meeting tomorrow? |
kb9vqf | time out, time out :) |
kb9vqf | too much text |
Xu_R | XD |
Xu_R | brb, my contacts are getting blurry... D: |
Borg^Queen | gross |
kb9vqf | yes, a portal would be nice |
MutantTurkey | and a maybe "phonebook" so to speak |
kb9vqf | I don't have time to iron out what should be on it |
kb9vqf | want to thrown up an Etherpad with what you guys want to seee? |
MutantTurkey | more like a contact page for us devels so other people have emails and such |
kb9vqf | *see? |
MutantTurkey | kb9vqf: i can do it |
kb9vqf | ok |
kb9vqf | then just Email it to me or something |
kb9vqf | re: the meeting |
kb9vqf | tomorrow may not be the best time |
kb9vqf | how about a week from tomorrow? |
Xu_R | back |
Xu_R | yes, gross D: |
Xu_R | kb9vqf: so postpone it a week? ok |
kb9vqf | yes, please |
MutantTurkey | http://trinity.etherpad.trinitydesktop.org/7 |
kb9vqf | OK, Email with account info sent |
kb9vqf | Borg^Queen: ^^^ |
Borg^Queen | ah ok thank you |
kb9vqf | Let me know when you have changed your password and I will grant commit access |
kb9vqf | Do you want access to just the packaging repo or the source code as well? |
Borg^Queen | very good, a little busy at the moment, can it wait a bit? |
kb9vqf | sure |
kb9vqf | just poke me or Email me when done |
Borg^Queen | whatever Xu_R needs, I'm going to test whatever he packages |
Xu_R | :D |
Borg^Queen | and there's the smirk |
Xu_R | teehee |
Borg^Queen | He sees his opportunity to torture me |
Xu_R | no, borgy, I will not install malware -_- |
Borg^Queen | lol |
Borg^Queen | I was taking a sip of water when the popped up |
Borg^Queen | I almost did a spit take into the fan |
Xu_R | *when the popped up? |
Borg^Queen | it rather |
Borg^Queen | [15:40] <Xu_R> no, borgy, I will not install malware -_- |
Xu_R | oh xD |
Borg^Queen | square kb and I uses ergos |
Borg^Queen | brb |
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Borg^Queen | hi |
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Borg^Queen | wb |
MutantTurkey | thanks ran into a bit of comptuer trouble |
Xu_R | wb |
Xu_R | ah, i'm late. |
Borg^Queen | pregnant? |
Xu_R | -_- no. |
MutantTurkey | O.o |
Borg^Queen | MutantTurkey: tis ok, you can relax |
MutantTurkey | haha |
MutantTurkey | I really need to get this dumb build problem fixedu p |
MutantTurkey | I am itching to work on real problems :P |
Borg^Queen | what's wrong? |
MutantTurkey | i have to update some scripts now that we are using git, annd fix an error with my kdebase script. |
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kb9vqf | Anyone here know this guy? |
kb9vqf | Pawel <0x4r0x@gmail.com> requested an account for trinity.etherpad.trinitydesktop.org |
Xu_R | kb9vqf: no... |
kb9vqf | If not I'll probably ignore his request |
kb9vqf | could be a spam bot |
Xu_R | ignore for now - and if anyone mentions on the list, then we'll know |
kb9vqf | yep |
kb9vqf | just thought I'd check here |
Xu_R | nice to know that the request feature works :D |
kb9vqf | :) |
kb9vqf | Yes...since the (ill-timed) upgrades most things appear to be working at 100% |
Xu_R | a very good thing indeed |
Borg^Queen | ? |
kb9vqf | On July 11th or so I did some upgrades and maintinance of the Trinity web services |
Borg^Queen | Xu_R: f15 ... OMG lol |
Xu_R | Borg^Queen: you can now request for an account on etherpad using a built-in form instead of us having to manually do it. |
kb9vqf | While this fixed a lot of problems I did manage to knock the Etherpad offline |
Borg^Queen | it seems gnome is the default ui, should I try kde4 |
kb9vqf | and then the derecho came through a few days later |
kb9vqf | so the timing ended up being very bad in hindsight |
Borg^Queen | oh blimey, I think its dead |
kb9vqf | ? |
Xu_R | ... |
* Xu_R wonders if Borg^Queen paid attention...? |
Borg^Queen | my fedora 15 install |
* Xu_R gets a no as an answer. |
Borg^Queen | about etherpad, yes sorry, |
kb9vqf | np |
kb9vqf | we have several topics going on here apparently |
* kb9vqf gets off to let the channel topic take precedence :) |
Borg^Queen | I'm new to all this so I'll have to learn on the fly regarding things like etherpad |
Xu_R | brb, dinner. |
Borg^Queen | k |
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Xu_R | back |
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Borg^Queen | ok time for me to go, gn or day to all |
MadRush | anybody useing trinity on debian squeeze? I'm getting a dependency problem trying to install |
Borg^Queen | what dep? |
eldowan | MadRush: I'm using trinity on squeeze |
Borg^Queen | well then, I'm off |
Borg^Queen | thank you eldowan |
eldowan | Borg^Queen: not sure what help i can be, i'm not at that machine. |
eldowan | but yw, all the same |
Borg^Queen | Well you'd know more than me, I haven't used Debian since Sarge |
Borg^Queen | must go, sorry to run off MadRush, I have to make my own mad rush |
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eldowan | MadRush: I'll be leaving here shortly, but any info you can provide? |
eldowan | I had to update some packages on my squeeze box (heh) before the install'd go through. though I dont' remember what |
MadRush | lol borg |
Xu_R | don't worry, Borg^Queen is always like that. |
Xu_R | ping kb9vqf |
MadRush | its just funny I use this nick but I forget that its actually words that can be used hah |
MadRush | whats the apt command to go ahead and do a safe update? |
Xu_R | apt-get upgrade |
MadRush | thanks |
MadRush | its been a while since I did that ... been using the update manager for quite a while now. |
MadRush | im tempted to make a squeeze vm real quick and see if it works on there |
eldowan | I think there's a switch that you cna use that won't do an update, but show you what would be installed. |
eldowan | aptitude -s will simulate, but not perform actions. |
MadRush | good to know. ive got to run but I'll be back later if I haven't made any headway |
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Xu_R | brb, upgrading virtualbox (which reset my damn connection) |
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MutantTurkey | kb9vqf: werid still no answer :[ |
MutantTurkey | also, I can't clone the git... |
MutantTurkey | did you run "update-server-info" on the server? |
MutantTurkey | fatal: http://cmorrison@trinitydesktop.org/scm/git/tde-packaging/info/refs not found: did you run git update-server-info on the server? |
* Xu_R hopes that kb9vqf is not using java's implementation of git that SCM-Manager is supposed to use... |
Xu_R | MutantTurkey: then again, I didn't have that problem... |
Xu_R | oh, I know |
Xu_R | MutantTurkey: check your url |
MutantTurkey | whats wron with that? |
Xu_R | it's scm.trinitydesktop.org/scm/git/tde-packaging |
Xu_R | you're missing the subdomain |
MutantTurkey | oh |
MutantTurkey | okay :) |
MutantTurkey | thanks! |
Xu_R | np |
MutantTurkey | this info should really be somewhere.. |
Xu_R | it is... |
MutantTurkey | ? |
Xu_R | scm.trinitydesktop.org |
Xu_R | if you login |
MutantTurkey | what is git.trinitdesktop.org? |
Xu_R | it also tells you your git clone command |
Xu_R | MutantTurkey: the cgit interface AFAIK |
MutantTurkey | oh here is a git tip if you dont want a giant wait to clone huge repos |
MutantTurkey | git clone URL --depth=1 |
MutantTurkey | only checks out most recent revision |
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Xu_R | MutantTurkey: My internet is fast (but comcast loves throttling me), and I've really had not many problems with many big repos. but thanks for the tip! |
MutantTurkey | but like when you clone the kernel... |
MutantTurkey | if you ever do |
MutantTurkey | it's annoyingly ridiculous :P |
Xu_R | oh, now I want to. XD |
MutantTurkey | Xu_R: yo so at this point all patches have been incorporated into qt3? |
Xu_R | pretty much. there's nothing really much more. |
MutantTurkey | have archlinux patches been looked at? |
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MutantTurkey | kb9vqf: hey I have all these qt3 patches in tde-packaging/arch/trinity-qt3/ and i don't know if they are still relevant |
MutantTurkey | (i am undergoing the conversion to git now) |
kb9vqf | can you see if they are in the qt3 master branch? |
MutantTurkey | how would i do that? |
MutantTurkey | is there a way to search? |
kb9vqf | you would have to load each patch and see if the changes are already in the source files |
kb9vqf | alternatively, check out the source and try to patch it |
kb9vqf | patch will complain if the patches are already in place |
Xu_R | MutantTurkey: just go with option 2, and use quilt. it'll make your life so much easier. |
MutantTurkey | ok :) |
MutantTurkey | I am terrible at remembering passwords D: |
MutantTurkey | kb9vqf: sorry to be a pain in the arse, could you reset me git password? |
kb9vqf | MutantTurkey: reset |
MutantTurkey | thanks |
kb9vqf | np |
MutantTurkey | does scm allow us to do oher things? or is it just a git manager? |
kb9vqf | it's a scm manager |
MutantTurkey | scm? |
kb9vqf | so I could also provide subversion or mercurial repositories |
MutantTurkey | okay |
kb9vqf | source control manager |
MutantTurkey | so many acronyms |
kb9vqf | iirc |
MutantTurkey | I thought it was vcs |
kb9vqf | I know :) |
kb9vqf | probably vcs is more generic |
Xu_R | lol |
Xu_R | scm, vcs |
Xu_R | both work in the end :P |
MutantTurkey | also what are we on |
MutantTurkey | 3.3.8c? |
Xu_R | yup |
MutantTurkey | ok |
MutantTurkey | oh my gosh this pkgbuild is way to complicated... |
kb9vqf | 3.3.8d technically |
kb9vqf | 3.3.8d being HEAD |
kb9vqf | 3.3.8c was already released |
kb9vqf | 3.3.8d may end up being the fully patched version of 3.3.8c |
MutantTurkey | head? |
kb9vqf | latest bleeding-edge version in the VCS |
MutantTurkey | wait so I should pull from the main/ though right? |
kb9vqf | yes |
MutantTurkey | or is that HEAD? |
kb9vqf | yes |
MutantTurkey | whats in experimental/ ? |
kb9vqf | let me put it this way: for an old stable project like Qt3 you want to pull the latest (HEAD) development sources from GIT |
kb9vqf | experimental contains tqt4 |
MutantTurkey | okay :) |
kb9vqf | and believe me it is HIGHLY experimental :) |
kb9vqf | will probably eat your cat and make trees fall on your car |
Xu_R | D: kitty hater! |
MutantTurkey | I'll stay away. |
kb9vqf | hehe |
MutantTurkey | kb9vqf: also a maybe ridiculous thought |
MutantTurkey | we want to use webkit, do we want to write a tqt interface for webkit? |
MutantTurkey | there already is a qt4 port for it, I don't know how much effort would be required |
MutantTurkey | kb9vqf: hrm another weird thing, I can do this: git clone http://scm.trinitydesktop.org/scm/git/tde |
MutantTurkey | but not git clone http://scm.trinitydesktop.org/scm/git/tde/main/dependencies/qt3/ |
kb9vqf | no? |
kb9vqf | what's the error? |
MutantTurkey | fatal: remote error: Git repository not found |
Xu_R | MutantTurkey: you could never do that with git last I checked. |
* kb9vqf is a GIT newbie |
MutantTurkey | Xu_R: yes you can I think... |
MutantTurkey | I am almost sure |
Xu_R | otherwise I would have done it with gitorious... |
MutantTurkey | maybe not |
kb9vqf | From what I understand it's not possible |
* Xu_R tests his gitorious for that |
MutantTurkey | you can do it |
kb9vqf | I'm basing that on the fact that, unlike SVN, there is no .git directory in each subdirectory of a repository |
MutantTurkey | sparse checkouts |
Xu_R | MutantTurkey: no, it didn't work here... |
Xu_R | oh, sparse checkouts, eww... |
kb9vqf | ?? |
Xu_R | there's this : http://stackoverflow.com/questions/600079/is-there-any-way-to-clone-a-git-repositorys-sub-directory-only |
MutantTurkey | what do you mean eww? |
MutantTurkey | it's identical to svn's way |
MutantTurkey | http://vmiklos.hu/blog/sparse-checkout-example-in-git-1-7 |
MutantTurkey | youjust have to set it up i think |
Xu_R | exactly why I said eww. |
Xu_R | you can't do that on an initial clone |
MutantTurkey | i know |
MutantTurkey | so what do we do? just force them to checkout everything? |
kb9vqf | well, not a problem with my server then |
MutantTurkey | kb9vqf: no :) |
kb9vqf | GIT does have limitations |
Xu_R | MutantTurkey: yea. pretty much. unless you want me to do branches? |
Xu_R | one branch per distro? |
kb9vqf | ick |
MutantTurkey | kb9vqf: so does svn :P |
MutantTurkey | anyway i think git has good advantages over svn |
Xu_R | (that actually sounds kinda good, doing branches) |
MutantTurkey | though this is one that seems pretty hefty annoying |
kb9vqf | I assume there would still be a way to check out everything? |
kb9vqf | I don't want to lose that |
Xu_R | kb9vqf: git clone takes out everything. |
kb9vqf | The more connections you have being established in an automated script, the higher the liklihood of failure |
MutantTurkey | right |
kb9vqf | well, as long as we retain the ability to have a large, editable "master" checkout of everything I don't care what is done about branches/sparse checkouts/etc. |
* Xu_R actually wants to work on a seperate branch for now with these mandriva SRPMS |
MutantTurkey | kb9vqf: hmmm got an email back from a developer |
kb9vqf | and? |
kb9vqf | not good? |
MutantTurkey | it was like off topic... |
kb9vqf | ? |
MutantTurkey | http://mailman.archlinux.org/pipermail/arch-general/2011-July/020977.html |
MutantTurkey | read |
MutantTurkey | kb9vqf: also, are you being trottled at liek 90kbs? |
kb9vqf | it sounds like they are not interested |
kb9vqf | I shouldn't be |
kb9vqf | which service is affected? |
MutantTurkey | just git cloning is really slow |
MutantTurkey | kb9vqf: thats only one developer, out of like 30... |
MutantTurkey | mostly what i was proposing was qt3 |
MutantTurkey | kdelibs3 i even said wasn't important until we went stable |
kb9vqf | 90kbits or 90kbytes? |
MutantTurkey | bytes |
kb9vqf | well that actually might be the max uplink |
MutantTurkey | oh, in that case sorry for stealing all your bandwidth :P |
kb9vqf | It's OK |
kb9vqf | you can't |
kb9vqf | :) |
kb9vqf | 90k isn't that bad in reality |
kb9vqf | if we find a bottlenect we'll start redirecting initial checkouts to another server |
kb9vqf | *bottleneck |
kb9vqf | I just don't know enough about GIT to do that yet :-P |
MutantTurkey | right |
MutantTurkey | i keep forgetting if i have mentioned this |
MutantTurkey | i started to mirror kde.org and am going to start mirroring our git |
kb9vqf | yes you did |
kb9vqf | when you have the git mirror please let me know |
MutantTurkey | okay I will |
MutantTurkey | now how do I not just mirror it, but allow other people to check out from me |
kb9vqf | I have no idea :-P |
MutantTurkey | I mean right now I am just cloning it into a directory on a cron job |
kb9vqf | That might work |
kb9vqf | As long as the entries for commit still point to *.trinitydesktop.org it should be OK |
MutantTurkey | yeah I don't know D: |
kb9vqf | Like I said my GIT knowledge is somewhat sparse still, so I'm playing it safe |
kb9vqf | and having people check out straight from the main repo |
MutantTurkey | is good |
MutantTurkey | I am just doing it mostly for backups now |
kb9vqf | sure |
Xu_R | getting tired now - night all |
kb9vqf | gn |
kb9vqf | MutantTurkey: Did your git checkout complete yet? |
MutantTurkey | kb9vqf: yes but the thing is I need to do it frequently |
MutantTurkey | which is annoying |
MutantTurkey | for some reason I cannot do --depth 1 |
* kb9vqf was just curious |
MutantTurkey | to speed it up considerably. |
MutantTurkey | do you know why that is? |
kb9vqf | no, sorry |
MutantTurkey | hrm |
MutantTurkey | now i am erroring upon building qt34 |
MutantTurkey | qt3' |
kb9vqf | error? |
MutantTurkey | uh |
MutantTurkey | /home/calvin/trinity-tree/tde-packaging/arch/master/trinity-qt3/src/tde/main/dependencies/qt3/src/tools/qdir.cpp:45:28: fatal error: private/qdir_p.h: No such file or directory |
kb9vqf | hmm |
kb9vqf | that is supposed to be a symlink |
kb9vqf | hang on while I look at it |
MutantTurkey | ok |
kb9vqf | MutantTurkey: fixed |
MutantTurkey | re pull? |
kb9vqf | yes |
MutantTurkey | ok building works now ;) |
MutantTurkey | could be easier than i thought |
MutantTurkey | gotta figure out how to keep it in opt |
MutantTurkey | just got to figure out how to package it right... |
MutantTurkey | lied. |
MutantTurkey | there are more errors |
MutantTurkey | actually... no idea whats up |
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MutantTurkey | kb9vqf: I dunno. Ill work on it tomorrow |
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Xu_R | kb9vqf: did you see the patches from Nix? |
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MutantTurkey | kb9vqf: seems that at least one of those patches wasn't in the main repo |
Xu_R | oh, patchwork is down... |
MutantTurkey | it doesn't matter |
MutantTurkey | I just attached it |
MutantTurkey | so we can still use it |
Xu_R | I know. I was just saying in general. Did you also see the patches from Nix? |
MutantTurkey | Xu_R: I told myself i would get up at like 8... didnt wake up till now haha |
MutantTurkey | yes briefly while laying in bed |
Xu_R | MutantTurkey: lol |
MutantTurkey | they were tqt patches |
MutantTurkey | hopefully fixing my problem |
Xu_R | nice to see some patches floating into the mailing list |
MutantTurkey | indeed. |
MutantTurkey | i really want to be more of a hel |
MutantTurkey | but until i get this system running triniy i am out of luck |
MutantTurkey | kb9vqf: okay, errors building qt3 now. ptrdiff_t does not name a type |
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* kb9vqf forgot about patchwork |
kb9vqf | drat |
tbottu | 10New TDE 3.5 bug 486 filed by jsullivan@opensourcedevel.com. |
tbottu | 04Bug http://bugs.pearsoncomputing.net/show_bug.cgi?id=486 major, P5, ---, kb9vqf, NEW, KOrgac reading Zimbra calendars via caldav crash constantly for almost all users |
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Borg^Queen | hi |
eldowan | y0 |
Borg^Queen | y0 |
kb9vqf | MutantTurkey: Patchwork is back online: http://patchwork.trinitydesktop.org/project/trinity/list/ |
Borg^Queen | bbs |
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kb9vqf | MutantTurkey: Patchwork did not catch your patch--did you attach it in plain text as requested earlier? |
kb9vqf | Xu_R: Patchwork registration should be functionali |
kb9vqf | *functional now |
Xu_R | kb9vqf: darn it, my first two attempts are still there - but my account is inactive... |
kb9vqf | Xu_R: I thought I deleted them |
kb9vqf | let me take another look |
kb9vqf | Xu_R: OK, try again |
Xu_R | ok, registered, and waiting for the registration email.... |
Xu_R | hm, I may sound impatient, but the email isn't coming (same thing like before) |
kb9vqf | really? |
kb9vqf | hmmm |
kb9vqf | it should :-/ |
Xu_R | :-\ |
kb9vqf | BTW before there was no SMTP account so the Email program just failed |
Xu_R | ah. |
kb9vqf | As long as you did not receive an HTTP/500 error then the Email *should* have been sent |
Xu_R | I didn't... :\ |
kb9vqf | Of course there could also be a bug in Django/Patchwork |
kb9vqf | who knows |
Xu_R | hehe |
Xu_R | kb9vqf: i'll check it again in a bit, I have to bbl. |
kb9vqf | OK |
Xu_R | bbl |
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MutantTurkey | o. |
MutantTurkey | o/ |
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MutantTurkey | hey guys |
eldowan | yo MutantTurkey |
eldowan | how's life? |
MutantTurkey | eh |
MutantTurkey | working and stuff |
MutantTurkey | two jobs, lots of linux stuff, have a great girlfriend, my band is coming together. |
MutantTurkey | things are looking pretty solid |
ar | do you have any time left for sleep? |
MutantTurkey | not at all |
MutantTurkey | I haven't been sleeping enough |
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eldowan | MutantTurkey: wow, that's a full plate and then some. |
eldowan | what kind of band? what's your rold? |
MutantTurkey | eldowan: uh sort of just like rock |
MutantTurkey | well thats not totally accurate |
MutantTurkey | but it's pretty close |
MutantTurkey | I am singer and guitar player and going to be the bass player when we find a replacement guitarist |
eldowan | oh nice. you guys just starting out, or you been in the scene for a while? |
MutantTurkey | this band is just starting up |
MutantTurkey | I was in a jam band earlier last year, and we had alot of cool material, but for some reason no one was motivated to gig at all. hence we just became a sort of jamband |
MutantTurkey | but i have the keys player from the old band, a new guitarist, and potentially a new drummer |
MutantTurkey | on top of that I am working on getting recordings done for other local bands |
MutantTurkey | eldowan: check this single out, I did for a band called Clairvoyance, which has alot of my pals in it |
MutantTurkey | http://www.facebook.com/clairvoyanceband?sk=app_178091127385 |
MutantTurkey | listen to "button up" |
eldowan | will do. |
eldowan | what are you p laying here? |
MutantTurkey | I producced it |
MutantTurkey | mixed, setup the studio space |
eldowan | gotcha |
MutantTurkey | basically all the work to let the band just focus on the music |
eldowan | they aren't bad. |
MutantTurkey | not for a bunch of kids... |
MutantTurkey | i think the quality is pretty good |
MutantTurkey | would like to vocals to be a bit warmer oh well. |
eldowan | eh, you can always remaster if you have the orig tracks. |
MutantTurkey | I do. |
MutantTurkey | but the vocals are just a tad crappy imho |
MutantTurkey | I cleaned it up about a million times better |
eldowan | ah, they don't seem to be the most steady, that's for sure. kinda seems he's a little sharp sounding (duno about flat / sharp, but i mean to my ears) |
MutantTurkey | yes I hear ya |
MutantTurkey | they also have like 3 people sining at once |
MutantTurkey | towards the end |
MutantTurkey | complicates fixing it |
eldowan | so true |
MutantTurkey | because it was done together |
eldowan | oh, on the one track? |
MutantTurkey | yes |
MutantTurkey | but that was the only one I did they put up |
MutantTurkey | the cracked glass demo is way worse quality, but whatever. |
eldowan | buddy of mine turned his house into a studio, did it right. soundproofed everything, master control room, silent rooms, nice vocal booth. |
eldowan | the entire 2nd floor is recording space, and his master bedroom is his mixing control room. |
MutantTurkey | thats the plan |
MutantTurkey | :) |
MutantTurkey | $30,000, a house and a decent ear = instant studio |
MutantTurkey | my buddy actually works for a new label startup and thats what the guy did. |
eldowan | oh nice. |
eldowan | yeah, he's on his way to finishing it and trying to attract artists to record. |
eldowan | he's also a /stellar/ musician, with contacts all over the city. so hopefully he does well. |
MutantTurkey | sounds like my buy |
MutantTurkey | guy' |
MutantTurkey | Ace Enders? |
MutantTurkey | 1 in a million chance... |
MutantTurkey | ugh builing on a G5 Mac takes forever... |
eldowan | nah, my guys is Cael. |
MutantTurkey | ah |
MutantTurkey | either way something i'd like to do |
eldowan | what region are you in anyway? we'er in the general Houston area. |
MutantTurkey | Philidelphia |
eldowan | ah, well that'd explain it. |
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MutantTurkey | yeah :) |
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MutantTurkey | yawn |
eldowan | yeah, can't wait for the day to be over. |
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Xu_R | kb9vqf: WOAH, finally found the patchwork confi'rmation email. |
Xu_R | it ended up in my spam |
Xu_R | because the email has "example.com" in it... |
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kb9vqf | example.com? |
kb9vqf | hmm |
* kb9vqf goes to check the configuration again |
Borg^Queen | does anyone have time to help me figure out an error build mkvtools? |
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eldowan | Borg^Queen: I dont' know how much /help/ i'll be... i usually install from apt |
Borg^Queen | ok |
Borg^Queen | I think I'm onto something hang ok |
kb9vqf | Xu_R: Should be fixed (I hope) |
Borg^Queen | ok it keeps saying checking for EBML... no |
Borg^Queen | the libebml libs are installed to /usr/local/lib and /usr/local/include |
Borg^Queen | this is the config line |
Borg^Queen | ./configure --with-matroska-include=/usr/local/include/matroska \ |
Borg^Queen | --with-matroska-lib=/usr/local/lib \ |
Borg^Queen | --with-ebml-include=/usr/local/include \ |
Borg^Queen | --with-ebml-lib=/usr/local/lib |
Borg^Queen | clearly I'm doing something wrong since they are installed |
MutantTurkey | Borg^Queen: what is the error |
MutantTurkey | are your paths correct? verify that |
Borg^Queen | checking for EBML... no |
MutantTurkey | did you double check the paths? |
Borg^Queen | that's the only error, not much feedback and yes, I checked the paths |
Borg^Queen | but let me check again |
MutantTurkey | is there an error file there? |
MutantTurkey | not sure what it maybe be called, but look in the dir |
Borg^Queen | checking |
MutantTurkey | may have some specificis |
Borg^Queen | yes they're correct |
MutantTurkey | okay |
MutantTurkey | any error in the build files? |
Borg^Queen | checking now |
Borg^Queen | one error |
Borg^Queen | conftest.cc: In function 'int main()': |
Borg^Queen | conftest.cc:15: error: 'exit' was not declared in this scope |
Borg^Queen | next |
Borg^Queen | configure:3368: g++ -c -g -O2 conftest.cc >&5 |
Borg^Queen | conftest.cc:11: error: 'void std::exit(int)' should have been declared inside 'std' |
MutantTurkey | okay that seems unrelated to the includes |
MutantTurkey | view the conftest.cc |
Borg^Queen | I know but just in case |
MutantTurkey | maybe thier test is failing to build... |
MutantTurkey | look at the file |
Borg^Queen | I see nothing |
Borg^Queen | what files should I be looking at |
Borg^Queen | it finds everything but that embl |
MutantTurkey | hrm |
MutantTurkey | no idea then :/ |
Borg^Queen | aye |
Borg^Queen | AH! find newer versions |
Borg^Queen | hang on |
MutantTurkey | ? |
Xu_R | back |
Xu_R | kb9vqf: works OK :D |
* Xu_R is now going to start throwing SuSE patches up knowing they don't get lost. hopefully. |
MutantTurkey | any recommends on windows free laptops? |
MutantTurkey | I don't want to pay the extra $150 for no reason. |
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kb9vqf | Xu_R: They won't be lost |
kb9vqf | tape backups are scheduled :) |
Xu_R | :D |
kb9vqf | just remember...plain text patches ONLY (as attachments preferred) |
kb9vqf | no .gz stuff |
MutantTurkey | no gz stuff? |
Xu_R | I always paste the patch into the message itself. |
* Xu_R never messes with attachments |
MutantTurkey | yeah I prefer that also |
MutantTurkey | so you can review them in commenting back :) |
kb9vqf | yes |
kb9vqf | and also so that patchwork will pick them up |
kb9vqf | patchwork doesn't decompress tarballs due to the danger of a tarbomb |
Borg^Queen | TAPE? |
kb9vqf | it's actually better than disk |
kb9vqf | lower BER |
kb9vqf | higher reliability |
kb9vqf | lower cost |
kb9vqf | :) |
Xu_R | I'm actually going to use a different email address for emailing patches because it's easier for me to keep track |
kb9vqf | sure |
MutantTurkey | any laptop recommends? |
* kb9vqf has had "good" "enterprise class" disks fail way too often |
kb9vqf | I used to recommend Lenovo but I think their stuff has gone down the sewer lately |
Xu_R | Lenovo is still pretty good. |
Xu_R | but yea, going down a bit faster than expected |
Xu_R | how about Toshiba? |
kb9vqf | The new stuff has a pretty high failure rate |
Borg^Queen | lenovo rocks |
* Xu_R thinks Toshiba is good |
kb9vqf | Stay far away from Toshiba IMHO |
Borg^Queen | toshiba is very anti foss |
Xu_R | ah. figures. |
* Xu_R only used Toshiba with windows |
Borg^Queen | I don't like toshiba, had business dealings with them, horrorible company |
MutantTurkey | yeah I am thinking a stinkpad actually... |
MutantTurkey | i like lenovo they are troopers |
Xu_R | stinkpad LOL |
kb9vqf | My r61 just keeps going...and going... |
Borg^Queen | lol |
eldowan | stinkpad indeed |
MutantTurkey | well that name is obviously applied joking. |
kb9vqf | also my T400 |
MutantTurkey | because they are the #1 trusted brand for buisnesses. |
Xu_R | ah, my cousin has a T400. It broke in China, and we got it fixed pretty quickly |
Xu_R | :D |
eldowan | we had almost every one of our old t41 era ones failed. |
Borg^Queen | MutantTurkey: my old ibm "stink" pad has been puked on by babies, thrown down a flight of stairs, and still works perfectly |
eldowan | Borg^Queen: really? we had almost the exact opposite experience |
MutantTurkey | so I am thinking a stinkpad then. |
Borg^Queen | eldowan: ? |
Xu_R | only yours, Borg^Queen, will ever face torture like that |
eldowan | w/ the stinkpads |
kb9vqf | My r61 has had water dropped on it, it's been sat on, and it still works great |
Borg^Queen | Xu_R: wait til you have kids |
MutantTurkey | really that bad of luck? eldowan |
eldowan | we had over 15 fail |
eldowan | and didn't even have 30 total |
Borg^Queen | I and curse you with a dozen kids |
Borg^Queen | eldowan: consumer or industrial machines |
kb9vqf | the new ones eldowan? |
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Borg^Queen | there's a HUGE differenece |
eldowan | Borg^Queen: business class, old IBM |
Xu_R | Borg^Queen: LOL. |
eldowan | kb9vqf ^ |
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Xu_R | how wonderful. |
MutantTurkey | hummmm weird. got disconnected |
eldowan | kb9vqf: gotta quick question about trinity for ya, fi you have the time |
MutantTurkey | anyway, experience with lenevo is positive? |
Borg^Queen | eldowan: if they run windows, they were not industrial grade |
Xu_R | lenovo = :D |
Borg^Queen | MutantTurkey: very positive. I even called them and ended up talking to 5 techs at once |
eldowan | Borg^Queen: aah, yeah, those were all old xp boxes |
MutantTurkey | excellent |
Borg^Queen | eldowan: not industrial grade |
MutantTurkey | specifically which ones? |
Borg^Queen | Generally the ones over 1k US with a 3 year warranty |
eldowan | ours? t40 t41 t42 IIRC |
Borg^Queen | the 1 year ones are consumers |
MutantTurkey | Borg^Queen: I don't need warranty. |
Borg^Queen | Ihave a t40 |
Borg^Queen | MutantTurkey: and you don't need a helmet or hand rails |
MutantTurkey | Borg^Queen: statistically not worth it... |
kb9vqf | warranty is a good thing.... |
Borg^Queen | aye |
MutantTurkey | statistically warrantys are not worth it. |
kb9vqf | yes they are for one reason: infant death |
Borg^Queen | I have a t30 that was beaten to death, new HD and BOOM working for 5 years and going |
kb9vqf | there is more and more infant death due to lower QC at the factory |
kb9vqf | no warranty == SOL |
MutantTurkey | kb9vqf: rreally? |
kb9vqf | yes |
MutantTurkey | its funny |
MutantTurkey | because normal companies will just give you a warranty and service |
MutantTurkey | only computer ones are assholes and charge extra... |
kb9vqf | don't get me started on the new "enterprise" hard disks I tried to purchase |
kb9vqf | hehe |
Borg^Queen | a computer is most likely to fail within 60 days of initial operation |
kb9vqf | right |
kb9vqf | that's "infant death" |
Borg^Queen | aye exactly |
MutantTurkey | then an included 1 year warrenty is nbest. |
Borg^Queen | if you get a industrial grade one, it will have linux and a 3 y war |
MutantTurkey | Borg^Queen: link please |
kb9vqf | I can personally recommend up to the T400 series |
Borg^Queen | a small Chinese man like Xu_R will follow you around of you get the special package |
kb9vqf | after that things get dicey |
Borg^Queen | t400 yes |
MutantTurkey | 420? |
kb9vqf | sounds like a consumer model |
MutantTurkey | they have a $700 sale. |
MutantTurkey | i mean.... |
Borg^Queen | avoid, the lowend and extremely high end |
MutantTurkey | 1750 vs 1000 |
kb9vqf | get the one with the mil-spec testing :) |
Xu_R | t400 ftw |
kb9vqf | the T400 had that testing and it just keeps going |
MutantTurkey | I am going to take the train, we can talk more when i get home |
Borg^Queen | agreed |
Xu_R | Borg^Queen: I'm freaking 6ft2... |
Borg^Queen | k be safe |
Xu_R | well, almost. like 6ft1... |
Borg^Queen | Xu_R: ahh industrial grade chinese |
Xu_R | ...-_- |
Borg^Queen | Wait I thought you were mexican |
MutantTurkey | t400 seems to be the older core2 models |
MutantTurkey | i need one with the i3 i5 i7 series |
Borg^Queen | yes, but its rock solid |
MutantTurkey | anyway gotta go! |
MutantTurkey | thanks! |
Borg^Queen | k |
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Borg^Queen | gn to all |
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MutantTurkey | night |
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alexbobp | I'm running trinity on debian |
alexbobp | one time I caught nepomuk using up 3GB of ram |
alexbobp | so I was wondering what nepomuk is for and how I can get rid of it if it's not important |
Xu_R | alexbobp: nepomuk is part of kde4. |
Xu_R | you can remove it freely via your package manager. |
alexbobp | ah okay |
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eldowan | alexbobp: when I log into my squeeze box I kill nepomuk and plasma-netbook and don't ahve any memory issues. if you remove nepomuk I think it may take all of kde4 away. I know that removing plasma-netbook wants to. |
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backwoodsman | hi all.. any chance of binaries being made for Debian Testing? I'd like to install Trinity on Mint Debian, but it's based on Testing, and the Squeeze binaries won't install due to unresolved dependencies. |
kb9vqf | working on compilation tests for Maverick now...binaries would be built after those are successful |
backwoodsman | Maverick? I thought those were already available. In any case, would that work on Mint Debian? |
kb9vqf | yes--for 3.5.12 |
kb9vqf | I'm tackling one problem at a time |
kb9vqf | by using a known-sane build environment I can know for certain that any problems I run into are a direct result of source changes from 3.5.12 to the current source HEAD revisions |
kb9vqf | once the code is known-good then I will build against other environments that may or may not work properly the first tiem |
kb9vqf | *time |
kb9vqf | and know that any problems I run into there are caused by the new environment, not fundamental flaws in the source code |
kb9vqf | :) |
backwoodsman | sounds good.. I'll try the Maverick binaries on Mint 11, I believe that should work. |
kb9vqf | ok |
kb9vqf | let us know if they work or not |
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backwoodsman | Neither Maverick nor Debian Squeeze install instructions work on Linux Mint 11, due to broken dependencies. |
backwoodsman | I guess I'll have to grit my teeth and install Ubuntu :) |
alexbobp | eldowan|afk: well... I'm A-OK with taking all of KDE 4 away :P |
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joeytwiddle | i still use XMMS too. it rocks! |
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eldowan|afk | alexbobp: good deal. both the netbook-plasma and nepokserver are in /usr/bin and I just mv <> <>.old and they don't start at all. I do like some of hte kde4 apps, so I may keep it around a bit. |
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kb9vqf | Xu_R: Keep adding patches to Patchwork... |
* kb9vqf has already handled quite a few: http://patchwork.trinitydesktop.org/project/trinity/list/?state=* |
kb9vqf | :) |
Xu_R | kb9vqf: nice! :D |
Xu_R | hmm... darn it - seems like patchwork mishandled some of my patches :-\ |
kb9vqf | ? |
Xu_R | ex. http://patchwork.trinitydesktop.org/patch/19/ it didn't get the whole patch |
Xu_R | the top half it got, the bottom half is still in the email message... |
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mk_MP | Hi, is there anyone else active on the channel except robots? |
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mk_MP | Hi, Borg^Queen, are you a bot or not? |
Borg^Queen | Of course I'm a bot |
mk_MP | Good. :-) |
* Borg^Queen assimilates mk_MP |
mk_MP | I am new to this channel and on the search for information... |
Borg^Queen | Ah ok shoot |
mk_MP | Trying to incorporate knowledge from the Borg. |
mk_MP | :-) |
Borg^Queen | lol |
mk_MP | Look, I only learnt about trinity project today. |
mk_MP | Any I am impressed. |
Borg^Queen | Its a great project, and getting better all the time. More and more distros are picking it up. |
mk_MP | I wondered whether trinity includes also QT3 and not only KDE3... |
Borg^Queen | It does |
mk_MP | I see. |
mk_MP | That sounds interesting indeed. |
Borg^Queen | it is |
mk_MP | Look, there is the idea to include trinity in MacPorts for Mac OS X. |
Borg^Queen | Sweet |
mk_MP | At the moment there is qt3 and qt3-mac available and also kde3... |
Borg^Queen | kb9vqf: is the founder, he would be very interested in this |
mk_MP | but there seems to be reoccuring trouble now. |
Borg^Queen | trouble? |
mk_MP | I learnt from a friend who recently upgraded to Lion with Xcode 4.1 that now (after selfupdateing and upgrading MacPorts) qt3 won't build anymore. |
Borg^Queen | sounds like a bug in the recent update |
Borg^Queen | report it to macports |
mk_MP | This is a real pain, since up to now KDE3 had always been our safety net with respect to KMyMoney. |
Borg^Queen | good app kmymoney |
mk_MP | KMyMoney4 on KDE4 is still having loads of trouble. |
Borg^Queen | what are the error msgs? |
Borg^Queen | everything in kde4 is having loads of trouble |
mk_MP | So, KMyMoney 1.0.5 was always a safe fallback solution. |
Borg^Queen | agreed |
mk_MP | With a broken qt3 port this would be gone. |
mk_MP | For me |
mk_MP | on Snow Leopart |
mk_MP | all is still okay |
Borg^Queen | hmm |
mk_MP | but my friend's machine is bonked with respect to KDE3. |
mk_MP | So, |
mk_MP | the idea was to get trinity up and running via MacPorts. |
mk_MP | I saw from your webpage that there are only Linuxes up to now supported. |
Borg^Queen | kb9vqf: is the man to speak to, he's the founder and who know far more about fixing it than I would |
mk_MP | But I think it would be really worthwhile to get it to life on Mac OSX, since it has evolved quite a bit since the 3.3.8 currently in qt3 port on MacPorts. |
mk_MP | OK, I wonder how I could contact kb9vqf... |
Borg^Queen | agreed |
Borg^Queen | hang on |
mk_MP | will do |
kb9vqf | Xu_R: Submit your patches as attachments |
kb9vqf | BTW I'm here :) |
kb9vqf | I have NO mac experience whatsoever |
mk_MP | Hi kb9vqf, good to see you here! |
mk_MP | Great project!!! |
kb9vqf | file a bug at http://bugs.pearsoncomputing.net with the compilation error message and I'll see if anything stands out :) |
kb9vqf | thanks! |
Borg^Queen | oih there he is |
mk_MP | Well, I don't know whether I'll be able to contribute really. but I'd try to get it to build here on the Mac. |
kb9vqf | we do maintain Qt3 so there is half a chance that I may be able to help |
mk_MP | Ah, ok, also for qt3 |
kb9vqf | I can't build it on a mac here (obviously) but if you provide the build logs I may be able to see what can be fixed |
Borg^Queen | kb9vqf: mac is a unix os (darwin) running a similair to kde3 UI |
mk_MP | Great. Good to be in touch then. |
kb9vqf | Borg_Queen: I know :) |
Borg^Queen | ah ok |
kb9vqf | but as far as hands on experience...well |
mk_MP | Yep, I'll use your bug tracker then. :-) Very good. |
Borg^Queen | kb9vqf: aye |
* kb9vqf counted clicks for common tasks on one once--that's it :) |
Borg^Queen | lol |
kb9vqf | mk_MP: Sounds good |
mk_MP | Is there a tarball avilable for download for trinity? |
kb9vqf | yes |
kb9vqf | 3.5.12 is on the main page |
mk_MP | Couldn't find the right link on the main page. Must have been blind. |
kb9vqf | hmmm...maybe it used to be there and isn't anymore |
* kb9vqf goes to look |
mk_MP | Please do, there are only instruction, release notes and that is it. |
kb9vqf | It's under the Releases tab |
mk_MP | Ah, ok |
kb9vqf | click 3.5.12 and there will be a tarball download like |
mk_MP | Found it. |
kb9vqf | *link |
kb9vqf | ok |
mk_MP | Would be better to have a more direct path to it. :-) |
kb9vqf | it is not obvious at all apparently :-P |
kb9vqf | Maybe "Downloads" would be better than "Releases" |
kb9vqf | ? |
mk_MP | Yep |
kb9vqf | OK |
* kb9vqf goes to change it now |
mk_MP | OK, I wonder what packages I'd need to get a running qt3 plus basic kde3, so that I'd be able to build kmymoney on to of that. |
kb9vqf | fixed :) |
mk_MP | I don't see a qt3 package anywhere... |
kb9vqf | qt3, arts, kdelibs, kmymoney |
kb9vqf | qt3 is in our GIT repository |
mk_MP | Again I am blind |
mk_MP | Oh |
kb9vqf | you caught us in the middle of a move to GIT |
mk_MP | THat's not obvious from the releases page |
kb9vqf | no it is not |
mk_MP | I see. |
kb9vqf | as of the 3.5.12 release we were NOT maintaining qt3 |
mk_MP | I'd like to have a tarball here as well. |
mk_MP | YOu are not? |
kb9vqf | 3.5.12 was released a while ago |
mk_MP | I thought you did as well, as being part of kde3/trinity?! |
kb9vqf | we decided to maintain qt3 after 3.5.12 was released |
mk_MP | Ah |
mk_MP | ok |
kb9vqf | make sense? |
mk_MP | yep |
Xu_R | kb9vqf: oh - nah, I like them inline in the end :P besides, it didn't catch MutantTurkey's when he sent his as an attachment |
kb9vqf | it didn't make it into the 3.5.12 release notes for obvious reasons ;-) |
mk_MP | So, I need a tarball of it as well. |
kb9vqf | hang on |
kb9vqf | http://git.trinitydesktop.org/viewgit/index.php?a=tree&p=Trinity%20Desktop%20Environment&hb=HEAD&f=main/dependencies/qt3 |
kb9vqf | There is a link at the bottom for a .tar.gz file |
mk_MP | OK, see it |
kb9vqf | this stuff is not publicly documented yet because 3.5.13 is not yet released |
mk_MP | No release number is actually connected with it... |
kb9vqf | right |
mk_MP | http://git.trinitydesktop.org/viewgit/index.php?a=archive&p=Trinity%20Desktop%20Environment&h=4116ba197904ebc0b37d7c2d4cef71d58aec6649&t=targz |
kb9vqf | 3.5.13 should come out in the fall if all goes well |
mk_MP | I see... |
mk_MP | Hmm... |
kb9vqf | then there will be more extensive release notes, including coverage of our qt3 repo |
mk_MP | OK, |
kb9vqf | as of right now qt3 is at version 3.3.8d |
kb9vqf | but that is not a final release |
mk_MP | ok. qt3-mac is at 3.3.8b, I think. |
kb9vqf | if you find bugs while compiling qt3 please let us know |
kb9vqf | and we will attempt to fix the problems and include them in the official 3.3.8d release |
mk_MP | OK, I'll try to download the stuff and try to build it here. |
kb9vqf | include the patches that is :) |
kb9vqf | ok |
mk_MP | OK, you 've to give me time though. I'm not the official maintainer of the qt3 port on MacPorts and have at first to figure out whether I can easily replace the current tarball against your modified one. |
kb9vqf | sure |
mk_MP | Once I've set it up I'll report back to you. |
kb9vqf | right |
kb9vqf | Email on the mailing list may be easiest |
mk_MP | Shall I use the bug tracker for communication with you |
mk_MP | or ML |
mk_MP | OK |
kb9vqf | trinity-devel or the bugtracker |
mk_MP | I see ML is best. |
mk_MP | I prefer ML |
kb9vqf | ok |
mk_MP | for discussions |
mk_MP | bt for bug. |
kb9vqf | yes |
kb9vqf | keeps it organized and neat :) |
mk_MP | OK, thatnks for now!!! |
mk_MP | Was great to talk to you!!!! |
kb9vqf | thanks, and thanks for offering to help in this area! |
mk_MP | Thanks for your help so far, I'll come back to you through the list and perhaps also using IRC. |
mk_MP | You are welcome. :-) |
mk_MP | OK, have to go to bed now. |
mk_MP | Bye!!! |
kb9vqf | see ya |
kb9vqf | :) |
mk_MP | :-) |
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kb9vqf | Xu_R: I have no idea why patchwork is eating inline patches |
kb9vqf | It's not my code after all :-// |
kb9vqf | maybe you want to ask upstream to the maintainer? |
kb9vqf | Also mac support sounds good |
kb9vqf | I was wondering if kmymoney was really that bad under KDE4...I guess it is! :-P |
kb9vqf | BTW kmymoney is in our source tree as of a few weeks ago |
* kb9vqf listens to the droning of crickets |
Xu_R | kb9vqf: I think it's because I didn't format the email message correctly >_> |
kb9vqf | well, don't do that :-P |
kb9vqf | Which ones are corrupt |
kb9vqf | ? |
kb9vqf | I'll mark them as rejected |
Xu_R | both of them, actually - (the ones with "Patches at Lincom" as the submitter) |
kb9vqf | ok |
Xu_R | I'll resubmit them |
kb9vqf | Ah, even better I was able to delete them |
kb9vqf | so submit away |
Xu_R | ok |
Xu_R | now to see if patchwork caught it. |
kb9vqf | Xu_R: Also, any chance that I can get some help with fixing the bugs on the bugtracker....?? |
Xu_R | sure |
kb9vqf | 3.5.13 is blocked on that |
kb9vqf | and by help I mean that you guys puck a bug, fix it, and send a patch in to the bug report :) |
kb9vqf | *pick |
kb9vqf | I'm pretty busy on this end keeping up with the patches and fixing glitches that are not reported to the bugtracker yet |
Xu_R | ok |
kb9vqf | also starting Natty builds, which will undoubtedly reveal a mass of steaming gcc4.6 problems |
Xu_R | ah, fun. |
Xu_R | i'll check for any gcc46 patches I can find |
* kb9vqf is not looking forward to it |
kb9vqf | ok |
kb9vqf | Here's another fun Qt4-related glitch |
kb9vqf | /usr/lib/gcc/x86_64-linux-gnu/4.4.5/../../../../lib/libtqassistantclient.a: could not read symbols: Bad value |
Xu_R | >_> |
kb9vqf | Only happens on kdevelop, and only on amd64 :-P |
Xu_R | oh god, that sucks |
kb9vqf | On the plus side I successfully built our Qt3.3.8d code under Debian |
kb9vqf | with only 4 patches needed :) |
kb9vqf | (Debian/Ubuntu specific patches) |
kb9vqf | sure beats the several dozen (!) that were originally required |
Xu_R | nice. |
Xu_R | D: wow. patchwork didn't catch my media-crypt_teardown.diff patch but caught the security one... |
* kb9vqf goes to investigate |
Xu_R | oh, and it messed up the patch inline again. |
* Xu_R sighs and gives up for now |
kb9vqf | beats me :;/ |
Xu_R | kb9vqf: you already have the patches anyway, so i'm assuming it's thunderbird that's screwing me up |
kb9vqf | as I said...attach them.... |
Xu_R | kb9vqf: it didn't catch MutantTurkey's ODBC patch that he didn't attach inline D: |
kb9vqf | grrr |
kb9vqf | I don't have the patience or time to pick through the ML to find patches |
Xu_R | >_> |
Xu_R | I know... |
kb9vqf | If patchwork isn't working can you post the URLs to the patches in the ML archives on an Etherpad? |
Xu_R | sure |
kb9vqf | thanks |
Xu_R | np |
Borg^Queen | gn to all |
Xu_R | nite borgy |
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Piki | hi |
Piki | kb9vqf, doesn't tbottu like being a tyrant? :-D |
kb9vqf | hehe |
kb9vqf | not anymore |
kb9vqf | not after his brain transplant |
Piki | transplant? |
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kb9vqf | I switched bots, as mozbot was not reliable enough |
kb9vqf | he may become a tyrant again if login abilities are desired on this channel...time will tell |
Piki | what bot are you using now? |
Piki | the trinity-users ML is listed as high traffic, but it has fewer posts for july than trintiy-devel, which is listed as moderate :-P |
kb9vqf | yes, I did notice that |
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hazridi | I just installed network-manager-kde-trinity (I'm running squeeze) and it doesn't seem to function. My wifi card is working properly and I can set it up manually or with ceni. |
hazridi | nevermind -- it was unmanaged due to being in /etc/network/interfaces |
hazridi | now trinity is pretty much KDE 3, but perfect |
kb9vqf | Glad to hear it :) |
hazridi | spoke a little too soon, as it doesn't seem to want to connect to either of my APs... cnetworkmanager is working though |
kb9vqf | I assume you restarted your machine after removing the interface from /etc/network/interfaces? |
kb9vqf | if not sometimes networkmanager gets confused |
hazridi | I restarted network-manager... using cnetworkmanager (cli interface to n-m) it connected OK |
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Xu_R | meep~~ |
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s15y2 | Hi, would this bug: http://bugs.kde.org/show_bug.cgi?id=124053 be hard to solve in trinity? |
tbottu | 04Bug 124053: was not found. |
s15y2 | "Having hundreds of feeds renders akregator useless." |
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Borg^Queen | Entities |
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Borg^Queen | gn to all |
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MutantTurkey | hey all |
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Xu_R | soo... what happened to tbottu? XD it looks like it had spazzing moments |
kb9vqf | I was getting messages in the logs requesting that I authenticate to Freenode.... |
kb9vqf | so I had to set up the authentication plugin |
kb9vqf | that little process required several reloads |
Xu_R | ah. |
Xu_R | looks like tbottu is dictator again then... |
kb9vqf | obviously it's working then :) |
kb9vqf | if people here don't like it I can probably deop him, but personally I don't see the harm |
MutantTurkey | :P |
MutantTurkey | I think he's good here. |
Xu_R | keep him :P |
kb9vqf | ok |
kb9vqf | MutantTurkey: Any progress on that "developers portal" page for the Website? |
kb9vqf | Or some bug fixes? :-) |
kb9vqf | Xu_R: You too regarding the bug fixes... |
kb9vqf | Maybe someone can look at that oh-so-stale BOTW in the topic? |
* kb9vqf is trying to keep things moving along.... |
MutantTurkey | kb9vqf: honestly I am trying to pull some free time together for it |
kb9vqf | ok, sounds good |
MutantTurkey | I still am working on getting it all built. |
kb9vqf | sure |
MutantTurkey | which makes me wonder if i should just do a debian install on another box to test and build trinity... |
kb9vqf | I'm also starting builds under Natty, so gcc4.6 issues should be resolved soon |
Xu_R | kb9vqf: many of the bugs on that bugtracker I'm not reproducing... which leads me to wonder if system is working right. |
Xu_R | *if my system |
kb9vqf | If you are not reproducing them flag that on the bug report |
MutantTurkey | kb9vqf: was I supposed to create the page? D: okay! :p |
kb9vqf | it is possible (likely even) that some of the more recent changes I put into SVN fixed some of the obscure bugs |
kb9vqf | that could have been caused by memory corruption |
kb9vqf | kdesktop was leaking like a sieve on later gcc versions |
kb9vqf | that has been fixed |
Xu_R | kb9vqf: I'm planning on reinstalling my trinity VM ASAP, so I'll try to see if I can reproduce the bugs again |
kb9vqf | good |
kb9vqf | If neither you nor MutantTurkey can reproduce a bug mark it as RESOLVED/INVALID and state that you cannot reporoduce it |
MutantTurkey | kb9vqf: so the whole kdesktop problem is fixed in the svn right? |
kb9vqf | Also ask the reporter to verify that he can reproduce it under the latest GIT |
kb9vqf | MutantTurkey: Yes! |
MutantTurkey | kb9vqf: sweet. |
kb9vqf | valgrind was helpful |
kb9vqf | but it still took quite a while |
MutantTurkey | I think i am going to clock out and get back to work |
kb9vqf | the problems were obscure |
kb9vqf | ok |
MutantTurkey | on trinity |
MutantTurkey | wow its thundering and storming like crazy all of a sudden |
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eldowan | oh, nice |
MutantTurkey | kb9vqf: so you are also using tde-packaging right? |
kb9vqf | yes |
MutantTurkey | this git problem is a pain in the arse |
MutantTurkey | the not being able to clone only parts of the tree |
MutantTurkey | kb9vqf: question abotu that odbc patch |
kb9vqf | yes? |
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kb9vqf | looks like I got bumped off |
kb9vqf | what was your question? |
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MutantTurkey | http://trinity-devel.pearsoncomputing.net/?0s::2714 |
MutantTurkey | piccoro said something, I have no idea what though. |
kb9vqf | If that is the same patch I am thinking of, yes, it was applied to the Qt3 branch in GIT |
kb9vqf | not sure though, and I'm not going to go picking through random tarballs to find out! |
MutantTurkey | mine or his? |
MutantTurkey | mine was a few lines |
MutantTurkey | updates a few defintions thats all |
kb9vqf | his |
kb9vqf | is yours not in GIT? |
MutantTurkey | thats why I sent it in to see... |
kb9vqf | link please? |
kb9vqf | if it was in patchwork I probably already processed it |
kb9vqf | BTW did I mention how much I hate Qt4? http://git.trinitydesktop.org/viewgit/index.php?a=commit&p=Trinity%%20Desktop%%20Environment&h=a7b8e6024196412a8849d00f68c01512dbf80e37 |
MutantTurkey | Invalid Project? |
MutantTurkey | link is a no go |
MutantTurkey | well, qt3 is building so far :) so hopefully that's one thing out of the way |
kb9vqf | invalid project? |
kb9vqf | on the git link I just posted? |
MutantTurkey | yes. |
kb9vqf | hmm, you're right |
MutantTurkey | I see it though |
MutantTurkey | I looked at it by the commit md5 or whatever |
MutantTurkey | Nokia is seriously dropping the ball lately. |
kb9vqf | Try this |
kb9vqf | http://git.trinitydesktop.org/viewgit/index.php?a=commit&p=Trinity%20Desktop%20Environment&h=a7b8e6024196412a8849d00f68c01512dbf80e37 |
kb9vqf | ah, ok |
MutantTurkey | yeah I got it. but that's ridiculous |
kb9vqf | I mean seriously, what's so hard about making sure that a double is actually a *double* so that comparisons work?!? |
MutantTurkey | Qt4 seems less and less viable haha. |
kb9vqf | hehe |
MutantTurkey | kb9vqf: did you report it? |
kb9vqf | no, because I don't have time to put together a test case |
MutantTurkey | ah |
kb9vqf | and I saw a couple bugs already |
kb9vqf | along those lines |
kb9vqf | Nokia's answer: "Tough rocks" |
kb9vqf | (paraphrased) |
kb9vqf | actually they went on about how double is an approximation |
kb9vqf | and this is to be expected |
kb9vqf | all I know is that behaviour like that is going to break a lot of code bery subtly |
kb9vqf | *very |
MutantTurkey | ... |
kb9vqf | In this case (TQString("3.3").toDouble() > 3.3) was returning TRUE! |
MutantTurkey | yeah they are dumb. |
MutantTurkey | how is "approximately" large? |
MutantTurkey | larger than? |
kb9vqf | I know |
kb9vqf | this worked: |
kb9vqf | In this case (TQString("3.2999999999").toDouble() > 3.3) was returning TRUE! |
kb9vqf | that is, (TQString("3.2999999999").toDouble() > 3.3) returned false |
kb9vqf | as it is supposed to |
MutantTurkey | oh man |
kb9vqf | and only on i386...and only on gcc4.6.... |
kb9vqf | :-P |
kb9vqf | (i.e. Ubuntu Natty i386) |
kb9vqf | MutantTurkey: Can you check this again? |
kb9vqf | rsync rsync://rsync.pearsoncomputing.net |
kb9vqf | I'm getting complaints of failure on the QuickBuild IP address again |
kb9vqf | yet the mirrors synced up normally this morning (???) |
MutantTurkey | also, if you want to make me a package mirror I could do that. |
MutantTurkey | I am getting nothing. |
MutantTurkey | it is just hnaging |
kb9vqf | great |
kb9vqf | /sarcasm |
MutantTurkey | :-P |
kb9vqf | Now I get to wonder if my ISP is throttling/disconnecting that port or if I had something fail |
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Xu_R | sorry for that random d/c |
Xu_R | windows is so lovely. |
MutantTurkey | honestly the windows desktop experience IMHO is way ahead of linux right now |
MutantTurkey | for regular users. |
Xu_R | I know... |
Xu_R | but the stability can kiss my @$$ |
MutantTurkey | yeah seriously |
* kb9vqf reminds MutantTurkey of Windows 8 |
MutantTurkey | windows 8? |
kb9vqf | ick ick ick |
Xu_R | AHHHH WINDOWS 8 *dies* |
kb9vqf | google it |
Xu_R | that new interface makes vista nice |
MutantTurkey | hahah |
* kb9vqf knows *gag* |
Xu_R | nice to know i'm not the only one thinking that XD |
kb9vqf | unlike Linux, there is no Windows 7 UI fork possible... |
kb9vqf | Linux may show its strengths ye |
kb9vqf | *yet |
Xu_R | hopefully |
MutantTurkey | so... |
MutantTurkey | It's like the windows 7 phone |
kb9vqf | well, I like to think I am in control of my desktop, and that just won't do it |
kb9vqf | I never feel fully in control of a cell phone :-P |
Xu_R | MutantTurkey: yup |
MutantTurkey | wow. |
MutantTurkey | so is it for a desktop or not? |
kb9vqf | yes, that's their new desktop |
MutantTurkey | weird |
kb9vqf | that and they want all people to program desktop apps in HTML5 and JavaScript |
kb9vqf | no C/C++/etc. allowe |
kb9vqf | *allowed |
MutantTurkey | what about C#? |
kb9vqf | No |
MutantTurkey | really? |
Xu_R | they want .net to die too now... |
kb9vqf | Nothing but HTML5 and JavaScript |
MutantTurkey | that was like a big microsot thing |
MutantTurkey | wow |
MutantTurkey | I mean this doesn't feel like a pc |
* kb9vqf thinks there will probably be a 6-figure cost for the "developers edition" |
MutantTurkey | it's all touch based? |
kb9vqf | yeah |
Xu_R | they expect all the PCs to be touch now |
kb9vqf | Now I am so glad that I don't do that Windows thing |
kb9vqf | :) |
MutantTurkey | yeah seriosuly |
Xu_R | XD |
MutantTurkey | this is great for linux! |
Xu_R | I still need windows for apps... D: |
MutantTurkey | Xu_R: no you wont |
Xu_R | (thank god for virtualbox full screen mode) |
MutantTurkey | all windows apps are going to be javascript + html. |
MutantTurkey | so they will be cross platform... |
Xu_R | I mean current apps |
Xu_R | that aren't JS/HTML |
kb9vqf | this sounds suspiciously like limiting the ability to generate new content |
kb9vqf | == big bucks paid to the few who have the tools to generate new content |
Xu_R | it sounds like Apple. |
kb9vqf | and I mean quality "AAA" content |
Xu_R | true. |
MutantTurkey | but you can still get to the old shell right? |
Xu_R | MutantTurkey: we're doubting that right now |
kb9vqf | not for long if M$ follows its history |
kb9vqf | general purpose computing, where everyone has the tools to develop new things, seems to be going away |
kb9vqf | it's sad really |
MutantTurkey | time for linux to rise :) |
Xu_R | I hope so :D |
MutantTurkey | not the way gnome3 is going... |
kb9vqf | hence this project |
MutantTurkey | they did the same thing as windows 8 |
MutantTurkey | I think xfce4 and triinty are the only two really good ones. |
kb9vqf | "Want to be a CREATOR, not just a CONSUMER?" |
MutantTurkey | as far as DE's |
kb9vqf | :) |
kb9vqf | we need a slogan |
MutantTurkey | I wish xfce was a bit more flxible. |
Xu_R | MutantTurkey: the only nice thing about GNOME 3 is extensions that allow you to completely change it (and make it gnome 2) |
MutantTurkey | I think that the "app" idea could come to trinity but i don't see how |
MutantTurkey | without bloating it up |
MutantTurkey | I DO like the windows 8 shell they showed for maybe using on a mobile phone or a television screen |
MutantTurkey | but not for a PC though |
Xu_R | agreed. |
kb9vqf | app idea? |
kb9vqf | what specifically? |
Xu_R | how about extensions? |
kb9vqf | to do what? |
Xu_R | actually, scratch that for now. I'm not thinking right |
* kb9vqf notes that the framework for "extensions" is probably already there |
* Xu_R is reinstalling trinity as we speak |
kb9vqf | in fact the entire UI theming system is a type of "extension" |
Xu_R | oh? |
MutantTurkey | right that would be cool |
MutantTurkey | kde3 is all module-ized |
MutantTurkey | right? |
MutantTurkey | like even with kparts and such |
kb9vqf | yes it is |
kb9vqf | so I ask again: |
kb9vqf | what do you mean by extensions? |
kb9vqf | what new functionality did you want to see? |
MutantTurkey | I am not sure what he means |
MutantTurkey | social networking extensions would be great |
Xu_R | what I meant by extensions is like what GNOME Shell did - to customize the interface. that's why I said scratch that for now |
kb9vqf | ah, ok |
kb9vqf | because we have that |
kb9vqf | there's even a theme to make a pretty good copy of OSX |
Xu_R | yup. |
* kb9vqf is not into social networking |
MutantTurkey | I know :P |
kb9vqf | but if one of you wanted to work on such a thing... :) |
kb9vqf | I would almost suggest that those functions should not be part of the desktop core like KDE4 |
MutantTurkey | indeed |
kb9vqf | but rather be added to Kopete/Kontact or some other systray resident app |
kb9vqf | or even a new systray app |
MutantTurkey | good thinking |
Xu_R | just curious - have any of you also tried GNOME shell already? |
kb9vqf | that's the sad thing: KDE4 requires you to interrupt your workflow and go to a widget embedded in the desktop, whereas the old systray model allows the user to receive/handle notifications without much interruption-- |
Xu_R | (and the extensions system?) |
kb9vqf | click and the window is up, click again and it's gone |
kb9vqf | Xu_R: no I have not |
kb9vqf | and probably will not |
MutantTurkey | less interuption is avorable |
MutantTurkey | Xu_R: I have. |
kb9vqf | avorable? |
Xu_R | avorable? |
MutantTurkey | favorable. |
kb9vqf | yes |
kb9vqf | that's the Trinity model |
* Xu_R agrees |
kb9vqf | in fact, the "docked apps" crud nowdays is just the systray model applied to arbitrary apps |
kb9vqf | we could do that with probably a few hundred lines of code or less |
MutantTurkey | yeah good thinking |
kb9vqf | but why? |
kb9vqf | it takes effort to design a good systray app |
MutantTurkey | if its not useful, then we shouldn't do it. |
kb9vqf | right |
kb9vqf | IMO that's what the taskbar is for ;-) |
MutantTurkey | I do think a certain amount of "new" stuff is good in a release! |
kb9vqf | of course! |
kb9vqf | but let's make it good new stuff |
kb9vqf | not rehashing old ideas |
MutantTurkey | indeed |
kb9vqf | something sorely lacking is the equivalent of the Windows display control center |
kb9vqf | that does not exist under ANY linux DE AFAIK |
Xu_R | when you mean display control center |
MutantTurkey | display control? |
Xu_R | you're talking like the drivers, screen resolution? |
MutantTurkey | I mean xfce has it |
kb9vqf | really? |
kb9vqf | cool |
MutantTurkey | hold up |
kb9vqf | hng on |
MutantTurkey | let me get a screen |
MutantTurkey | http://imagebin.org/164847 |
MutantTurkey | I don't know how it handles multiple monitors or anything ( i don't know much about how it works, and only have one screen) |
Xu_R | I'm thinking kb9vqf means more like options that you can only find by modifying Xorg.conf...? |
MutantTurkey | Xorg.conf doesn't exist anymore doesi t? |
MutantTurkey | I know at least archlinux dropped it by default... |
Xu_R | it's dropped by default, but you can still use it (Xorg.conf.d) and sometimes autoconfiguration doesn't work well |
Xu_R | I know it's one reason that openSUSE went to work on making SaX3 (xorg config tool) |
MutantTurkey | and doesn't kde4 have a decent one? |
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kb9vqf | MutantTurkey: Try the GIT now |
kb9vqf | mdadm decided to reconstruct the array on /dev/sdx instead of /dev/sdx1 :-P |
Xu_R | kb9vqf: is the keyserver up? |
kb9vqf | Dunno yet |
kb9vqf | mdadm gave enough of a scare that I haven't checked |
Xu_R | ah. |
kb9vqf | try the rsync |
kb9vqf | rsync rsync://rsync.pearsoncomputing.net |
kb9vqf | if that works then they keyserver will be up shortly |
kb9vqf | *the |
Xu_R | i'm not supposed to be getting timeouts, right? |
kb9vqf | no |
Xu_R | (both keyserver and rsync report a timeout) |
kb9vqf | grrr |
MutantTurkey | rsync hangs |
MutantTurkey | git is up |
kb9vqf | good |
kb9vqf | rsync is on the malfunctioning interface |
kb9vqf | the one that prompted the reboot |
kb9vqf | I'll have to look into it further |
Xu_R | ah... |
Xu_R | i'm guessing the malfunctioning interface is quickbuild? |
kb9vqf | yep |
kb9vqf | BUT |
kb9vqf | it was working just fine this morning |
kb9vqf | and all indications are it still works from this end |
kb9vqf | so I'm wondering if my ISP is actually having the problem ATM |
MutantTurkey | did you call them? |
Xu_R | probably. do they have a status page? |
kb9vqf | no time yet |
kb9vqf | still working on bringing services up from the reboot |
kb9vqf | :) |
Xu_R | ah. |
kb9vqf | i'll let you guys know when I know something |
Xu_R | ok |
MutantTurkey | qt is building away. |
Xu_R | brb early dinner |
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kb9vqf | MutantTurkey, Xu_R: Back online |
kb9vqf | the modem kicked the interface |
kb9vqf | rebooting fixed it |
kb9vqf | Xu_R: Can you please check the keyservers? |
MutantTurkey | cool |
kb9vqf | every now and then it seems the ISP rejects a MAC address, especially under high load |
kb9vqf | if this keeps up I will have to figure out why |
kb9vqf | I take it everything is working now/ |
kb9vqf | ? |
MutantTurkey | I was cleaning my fan on my heatsink on an old computer a friend gave me, tried to take the fan off and the whole cpu and heatsink came with it... |
MutantTurkey | haha |
kb9vqf | A Pentium 4? |
MutantTurkey | celeron D |
MutantTurkey | just a little behind a P4 |
MutantTurkey | why? |
kb9vqf | they have a nasty habit of gluing to the heatsink |
kb9vqf | permanently |
MutantTurkey | yeah |
MutantTurkey | I hated P4's |
MutantTurkey | but they were good workhorses |
MutantTurkey | ran hot as hell |
kb9vqf | yep |
kb9vqf | the bad old days! |
MutantTurkey | the bad old days |
MutantTurkey | now I have a slick atom :) |
kb9vqf | which can't do very much IIRC |
kb9vqf | hmmm |
kb9vqf | maybe those were the good old days :) |
MutantTurkey | they do absolutely nothing :) |
MutantTurkey | but nothing@12W@20C... |
MutantTurkey | the computer paid itself off in power savings two years |
kb9vqf | ah, but what services did you have to pay for to replace the lost functionality? |
MutantTurkey | ? |
MutantTurkey | GAH BENT PIN :[ Processor is now useles.. ._. |
Xu_R | back |
kb9vqf | for example if you were building software you would now have to pay for an external build service, etc. |
Xu_R | checking the keyservers |
kb9vqf | ok |
Xu_R | keyservers working |
kb9vqf | great |
kb9vqf | MutantTurkey: Any chance you could set your VPS to check the status of the primary Trinity services (keyserver, etc.) and send an Email to me if they are down |
kb9vqf | in an automated way? |
kb9vqf | That would be a GREAT help |
kb9vqf | or even poke me privately on IRC, but that is probably more complex |
Xu_R | that sounds like pinging each of your subdomains... |
kb9vqf | ping won't work |
kb9vqf | but if you can telnet to 80 on my two IP addressess then everything is OK |
kb9vqf | I can write the status check software if you want |
kb9vqf | it would probably be in bash though |
kb9vqf | the problem is I have no way of knowing if external access to either IP is actually working |
kb9vqf | e.g. this recent problem still allowed internally generated traffic through (!??!?) |
Xu_R | o_o |
kb9vqf | I really wish Internet service in the USA was more reliable :-/ |
kb9vqf | No one wants to spend money to make it so |
Xu_R | :-\ |
MutantTurkey | hmmm seems complicated |
MutantTurkey | if you want to just write a script that I can cron |
MutantTurkey | it would be good |
kb9vqf | ok |
kb9vqf | I'll see what I can do |
kb9vqf | I just have no way of knowing if something is inaccessible until someone mentions it right now |
kb9vqf | which is not a good way to handle the site |
MutantTurkey | I agree. |
MutantTurkey | I could have my vps check hourly, and send you an automated phone call or something? |
MutantTurkey | because if the website goes down, how can we reach you? |
MutantTurkey | I guess on the irc also would work |
kb9vqf | email usually stays up |
kb9vqf | if email is down then I have automated checks that let me know anayway |
kb9vqf | *anyway |
kb9vqf | can I just use the mail command on your VPS? |
kb9vqf | or is that not configured? |
MutantTurkey | not configured unfortunately :| |
MutantTurkey | I haven't bothered to set anything up, I don't know how complicated it is |
kb9vqf | oh |
kb9vqf | see nullmailer |
MutantTurkey | I have dinner right now, and my girlfriend will be over. hopefully I can hop on tonight |
kb9vqf | sure |
MutantTurkey | Assume mail command does wokr. |
kb9vqf | ok |
MutantTurkey | I will get it up and going |
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grand_grunt | Hi! :) |
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grand_grunt | I think I found a bug: when lauching kolourpaint (from trinity), then opening and editing a file from a sshfs mount, then closing kolourpaint, then umounting sshfs, at next launch kolourpaint stays stalled. |
grand_grunt | strace shows that it tries to access the last opened file. |
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grand_grunt | also, sshs was "unmounted" an ugly way, bash is also stalled when trying to ls it. But it is less obvious to guess where the trouble comes from when launching kolourpaint. |
MutantTurkey | grand_grunt: hey |
MutantTurkey | can you file that bug report? |
grand_grunt | Yep, sure. |
MutantTurkey | that's really easier for us |
MutantTurkey | that way we don't loose track of bugs :) |
grand_grunt | Was talking here first in case someone would say "corrected in latest version" or "already filled in 4 times" |
MutantTurkey | grand_grunt: what version are you running? |
MutantTurkey | It might not occur. |
MutantTurkey | just file the bug report that way we deal with it :) |
MutantTurkey | but i've gotta go! good luck with the bug and thanks for reporting it! |
grand_grunt | versions: http://pastebin.com/f18zXNGy |
grand_grunt | I must insist that sshfs was in ugly state, thinking twice. But used to it for direct access ("ok, stalled because I broke the ssh session"), not for a bare launching of kolourpaint. |
MutantTurkey | once you report it, one of use running the SVN version can check to replicate the error, it might have beenfixed already |
grand_grunt | Here it is: http://bugs.pearsoncomputing.net/show_bug.cgi?id=488 |
tbottu | 04Bug 488: minor, P5, ---, kb9vqf, NEW, kolourpaint, okular (maybe others) are frozen by defuncted SSHFS mount. |
Xu_R | kb9vqf: are you doing nightly builds for squeeze? |
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grand_grunt | http://pix.toile-libre.org/upload/original/1311639437.png <= wanted to share this with you :) |
grand_grunt | good night, kind developpers. |
Xu_R | lol |
grand_grunt | BTW, servers for Trinity repository seems to be lagging sometimes. I own two 100Mb/s servers, can do mirrors if this may help. Just query me, will se later. going to sleep. |
kb9vqf | Xu_R: Not yet for Squeeze; Natty isn't even fully built yet |
Xu_R | kb9vqf: which has nightly builds? because if squeeze doesn't I would like to be able to have one with nightly builds |
kb9vqf | Maverick is fully built |
kb9vqf | Natty is next (in process) |
kb9vqf | then Squeeze, then (maybe) Unstable\ |
kb9vqf | Xu_R: Check the keyserver please |
Xu_R | working here... |
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Xu_R | the borg arrives... |
kb9vqf | Xu_R: hmm, had someone write and say that it was still down where he was at |
Xu_R | kb9vqf: strange. it's working fine here... |
kb9vqf | He did this |
kb9vqf | apt-key adv --keyserver keyserver.quickbuild.pearsoncomputing.net |
kb9vqf | --recv-keys 2B8638D0 |
kb9vqf | which would work I would think |
Xu_R | yea - that's the same command I used |
Xu_R | it works here |
kb9vqf | hmmm |
kb9vqf | I may have to move that function to the other IP address |
* kb9vqf does not look forward to that |
Xu_R | doesn't sound fun. |
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Xu_R | kb9vqf: you said you were doing builds for natty... mind if I have a link to what you have so far? (because I accidentally installed Natty instead of Maverick) |
Xu_R | it'll be a good way for me to test for any strange behavior too. |
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kb9vqf | Xu_R: It's not much yet, but here you go.... https://quickbuild.pearsoncomputing.net/~trinity/+archive/trinity-nightly-builds/ |
kb9vqf | as in, I only have arts and kdelibs in there so far :-P |
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MutantTurkey | kb9vqf: I know I said it would get the whole mail thing setup |
MutantTurkey | but what was supposed to be a nice night out to dinner with my famiily ended up being a disaster |
MutantTurkey | heavy flash flooding caused alot of water in my basment |
MutantTurkey | I have been bailing it out with a shop vac most of the night. |
MutantTurkey | at this point I am wet, tired and smelling musty |
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hazridi | So, I noticed knetworkmanager seems to fail at connecting to an AP using WPA1/AES, while it connects fine to an AP that is advertising WPA2 support |
kb9vqf | hazridi: That is a useful bit of information |
kb9vqf | Can you please verify that the gnome network manager successfully connects to the WPA1/AES AP? |
kb9vqf | if so a bug report may need to be filed against knetworkmanager |
hazridi | not gnome, no |
hazridi | but cnetworkmanager worked fine |
hazridi | (cli network manager client) |
hazridi | how hard is it to build trinity components on squeeze? if I can use apt for the source I could take a look at it |
kb9vqf | hazridi: It shouldn't be too hard |
kb9vqf | use the Maverick repository |
kb9vqf | or wait a few weeks for the Squeeze nightly builds to start |
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grand_grunt | Would you like a mirror server? What are the requirements? |
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raevyn | Hi! My date/time applet I have has suddenly started showing me the timezone I am in, and no longer the date. Does anyone know how to correct that? |
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l0ner | hello? |
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Space_Man | hi l0ner |
l0ner | hi |
Space_Man | grand_grunt: kb9vqf controls the master repo, there maybe a mirror somewhere idk |
l0ner | problems? |
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MTurkey | hello? |
l0ner | hi |
MTurkey | awesome! just testing out my phone app for the meeting later. |
l0ner | meeting? |
Space_Man | l0ner: about 8 hours ago"<grand_grunt> Would you like a mirror server? What are the requirements?" |
MTurkey | there is a devel meeting tonight at 1900 |
Space_Man | there is a meeting later today |
l0ner | didn't know |
l0ner | nice |
Space_Man | "... tonight at 1900" what time zone? |
l0ner | Space_Man: i've seen mirror for .deb packages somewhere (university of idaho or smthin), but requires key from kb9vqf server |
MTurkey | EST |
MTurkey | or Easter Daylight Time (because of daylight savings ) |
l0ner | and EST is UTC+? |
l0ner | right now |
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l0ner | i'm asking since i never really understood how EST works... |
Space_Man | its like standard time and on the east |
Space_Man | :P |
l0ner | ok... |
l0ner | uh... I'm trying to build trinity from svn sources on my gentoo |
l0ner | firstpass: tqtinterface. Error: "Your Qt3 is not patched for compatibility with tqtinterface"... |
kb9vqf | build our Qt3 branch first |
kb9vqf | and install it |
kb9vqf | build sequence is Qt3->tqtinterface->arts->kdelibs->kdebase |
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l0ner | ok |
l0ner | I installed qt3 from kde-sunset, thought it might work |
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l0ner | actually I'm on kde from kde-sunset, and I'm already tired of fighting agains updates to kde 4 ;/ |
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l0ner | uh. Question: where I can find trinity qt3 branch? Can't find it on svn |
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MTurkey | Xu_R: got irc on phone |
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Xu_R_ | MTurkey: nice |
Xu_R_ | i was just having server troubles here, but seems to be fixed now |
Xu_R | so lemme close that webchat... |
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* Xu_R had to upgrade his router to use DD-WRT because there were problems with the old firmware that never got fixed |
MTurkey | so router is all ok now? |
Xu_R | yea |
kb9vqf | l0ner: It is in our GIT tree at http://git.trinitydesktop.org |
kb9vqf | under Trinity Desktop Environment->main->dependencies |
kb9vqf | you can download a tarball via the link on the bottom of the webgit page |
l0ner | ok |
l0ner | will look now |
l0ner | why etherpad access is under registration now? wasn't something like month ago... |
MTurkey | l0ner:we reset the ether |
MTurkey | kb9vqf: still have trouble with qt3. building ok though now |
kb9vqf | trouble? |
MTurkey | packaging function is messy still |
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Borg^Queen | hey people wanted let you guys know I can't be here for the meeting, been working 26 hrs straight. I'm off to sleep. |
Borg^Queen | Just didn't want you lads and lasses to think you were being ditched. |
Borg^Queen | gn to all |
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* Strangelv missed the meeting announcement |
Strangelv | :: scrolls up and sees something that looks like 18:00 CDT |
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l0ner | ok, I can't compile qt3 |
Space_Man | pastebin the output - last few lines with the error messages |
Space_Man | I've never built qt3 or trinity |
Space_Man | but somebody here might be able to help |
l0ner | error http://pastebin.com/4jswE6wF |
l0ner | I don't like using binaries or binary-based distros. They feel bloated |
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kb9vqf | l0ner: Pull Qt3 from GIT again and retry your build |
kb9vqf | A patch snuck in that should not have been included, as it is Debian specific |
l0ner | ok, will report if the build was successful |
kb9vqf | ok, if not please verify the hash of your GIT pull, it should be 11b82515f821fbdbdd6b04f3e6695b710d1e70cd |
kb9vqf | Xu_R: Please send all the patches you have to me directly |
kb9vqf | I will manually put them into Patchwork |
kb9vqf | send them as individual attachments |
kb9vqf | on one Email message |
kb9vqf | your Email program was inserting line breaks into the patch text, which made the patches completely unusable |
kb9vqf | I would like to get them in to kdebase BEFORE I do the multi-distro rebuild |
Xu_R | kb9vqf: I'll try to ASAP - right now my computer is having problems... |
Xu_R | (you can always pull from build.opensuse.org too) |
Xu_R | kb9vqf: when are you going to do the multi-distro rebuild? |
kb9vqf | working on starting it now...but only up to kdelibs |
kb9vqf | I only want the patches that are not already in SVN ;-) |
kb9vqf | so if you could pre-filter them for me it would be a great help |
Xu_R | I'll try to ASAP. |
kb9vqf | OK, thanks :) |
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MTurkey | work is slow |
eldowan | agreed |
MTurkey | yawn |
eldowan | 15 more minutes... |
kb9vqf | ? |
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l0ner | damn my laptop is overheating |
kb9vqf | qt3 compilation can be nasty |
kb9vqf | try slowing down your CPU |
l0ner | already did |
kb9vqf | ohh |
kb9vqf | blow out the dust from the CPU fan vent with a high pressure air source ;-) |
l0ner | theorically the pcu should slow down by itself |
l0ner | did this morning |
kb9vqf | up to a point |
kb9vqf | what CPU is it? |
l0ner | intel i3 m350 |
kb9vqf | ah |
l0ner | but it's samsung laptop |
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l0ner | and this is the main problem |
kb9vqf | with an undersized fan no doubt |
kb9vqf | fan/heatsink |
l0ner | yeah |
kb9vqf | usually putting the CPU on max power saving will keep it running |
kb9vqf | either that or use ctrl+z to suspend the compilation |
kb9vqf | then run 'fg' to resume it when the CPU is cool enough |
l0ner | and some obscure functions in bios for power management |
l0ner | this is what i've been doing |
kb9vqf | ah, OK |
kb9vqf | I can't help much then :) |
l0ner | but i got distracted, temp went up and laptop shut down |
kb9vqf | uggh |
kb9vqf | you do know we have Qt3 for Maverick and Natty in the nightly builds.... |
kb9vqf | not sure which distro you are on |
l0ner | gentoo |
kb9vqf | that won't help then! |
l0ner | i tried ubuntu |
l0ner | i just can't get over with dependencies, bloatware, and how binary distros forces things on me |
l0ner | after you tried one time gentoo, you are long gone |
l0ner | you will never return to binary |
kb9vqf | well, when you have a fleet of computers to maintain binaries sound quite good ;-) |
l0ner | you bet |
l0ner | whoah! that was unexpected. |
l0ner | I'm beginning to wonder if my cpu reports it's temp right... |
l0ner | paused compilation and temp went instantly from 86C to 60C |
l0ner | how can I access the trinity eherpad? wanted to take a look on cmake porting status |
-Xu_R- Attention: Meeting in #trinity-desktop-meeting at 1900 EDT (that would be 25 minutes from now) |
grand_grunt | kb9vqf: Does the trinity project have enough servers with enough bandwidth? |
kb9vqf | grand_grunt: so far, as far as I can tell, yes, BUT if you want to be a mirror we'd be glad to have you |
kb9vqf | all you need is a server with enough monthly bandwidth to handle file transfers daily |
kb9vqf | i.e. no cap |
kb9vqf | no monthly transfer cap, and no residential connections |
kb9vqf | unless you are lucky enough to have fiber in your area ;-) |
l0ner | live in japan and you probably will |
-Xu_R- Meeting starting in ~1 minute(s). |
grand_grunt | kb9vqf: I have too servers in France, with no cap on bandwidth (France is still a nice country for this) |
grand_grunt | If you got a pointer about "How to make a mirror" I would be happy to do one |
kb9vqf | ok |
kb9vqf | hang on a bit |
kb9vqf | in a meeting |
l0ner | quiet idea: a mirror of site and pgp keyserver would be nice too, since from what I've seen they have problems sometimes... |
grand_grunt | Another idea: some round robin DNS would be also nice |
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Xu_R | now to fix this computer. brb |
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kb9vqf | grand_grunt: I do have round robin set up for the mirrors |
kb9vqf | you can rsync from rsync://rsync.pearsoncomputing.net |
kb9vqf | send me the URL when you complete the initial download |
kb9vqf | set it to sync every day or so |
kb9vqf | (every 24 hours) |
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l0ner | ok, i finished compiling qt3 |
l0ner | but it |
l0ner | stays in build dir |
l0ner | and don't go to dir included in $QTDIR |
* l0ner is going to getsome sleep. Needs to wake up in 7 hours. |
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grand_grunt | kb9vqf: Ok, thanks :) |
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Strangelv_ | Did I completely miss the meeting? |
* Strangelv_ was distracted by getting his air conditioning repaired |
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Xu_R | Strangelv_: yea :( |
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MutantTurkey | Xu_R: can you update the meeting page on the wiki once your logs sync? |
MutantTurkey | kb9vqf: I've been reviewing the links on the main website, i thikn some of them can just go into the devel section of the website. |
Xu_R | sure - but feel free to remind me, I might forget |
kb9vqf | correct |
kb9vqf | just make me a list... :) |
MutantTurkey | kb9vqf: I think patches, SVN, andRoadmap can go into it. |
kb9vqf | yes |
kb9vqf | send along those suggestions in the Email :) |
MutantTurkey | kb9vqf: :) ok! |
MutantTurkey | kb9vqf: also is that news system I setup working ok? |
kb9vqf | yes |
kb9vqf | it's great! |
MutantTurkey | excellent. |
MutantTurkey | I knew it would be, simple and easy! |
kb9vqf | when natty nightly builds are done there will be a new new entry... |
kb9vqf | *news |
MutantTurkey | yep |
MutantTurkey | I also am looking into using your quickbuilds for archlinux. In fact it's often quite easy to convert packages to different distros |
MutantTurkey | that might save me a lot of trouble, building and packaging wise |
kb9vqf | sounds good to me |
kb9vqf | if you manage to automate the conversion process let me know |
kb9vqf | and I will autogenerate the Arch packages |
kb9vqf | with your automated scripts |
MutantTurkey | kb9vqf: ok that would be cool. |
MutantTurkey | you could also just build them regularly. |
MutantTurkey | all you need is our package manager installed (not managing, just installed) I think you could just do that. |
kb9vqf | what format are your packages? |
Xu_R | which makes me wonder - kb9vqf - when we move to git, will we have hooks set up? I can just have the hooks call a rebuild of any packages |
kb9vqf | .deb, .rpm? |
kb9vqf | yes, hooks will be available |
MutantTurkey | pkg.tar.{gz,bzip2,bzip,xz} |
kb9vqf | hmm |
kb9vqf | ok |
Xu_R | great - all I need is an API call to api.o.o. |
MutantTurkey | its a custom one :) |
kb9vqf | I can't easily do release updates with that as QuickBuild can't understand it, but I can provide nightly / automated builds and let you pick and choose the release package set |
kb9vqf | not sure yet |
MutantTurkey | right we can talk later. |
MutantTurkey | also, could you send me current php page from the website? they are all post-processed so it's not good to use |
MutantTurkey | wait... maybe if i just use one that isn't using any formatting it'll be ok. |
MutantTurkey | nevermind! |
MutantTurkey | Actually, I probably need one emailed to me :P |
kb9vqf | I can add the PHP stuff |
kb9vqf | headers/footers |
kb9vqf | I just need the body :) |
MutantTurkey | kb9vqf: ok I will send just the body portion |
MutantTurkey | also: http://ekaia.org/blog/2011/02/07/post-and-pre-release-fun/ |
MutantTurkey | that notes that "One of the goals for wheezy is remove completely KDE 3 and Qt 3. " |
MutantTurkey | wheezy is debian 7 |
kb9vqf | nice :-P |
kb9vqf | I'll be providing Qt3 anyway |
kb9vqf | Qt4 is NOT a replacement for certain workloads |
kb9vqf | and I would hate for people to stop using Debian or Linux |
kb9vqf | just because Qt4 is a bloated unstable piece of garbage sometimes |
MutantTurkey | yes I feel the same way about gtk3 (which is even worse that 2.x...) |
MutantTurkey | kb9vqf:other than links, do we need anything else? |
kb9vqf | stopped using GTK as soon as the tools became steaming piles of trash |
kb9vqf | the graphical dev tools that is |
kb9vqf | when the icons in buttons start overlapping on the text with no way to fix it...well.... |
MutantTurkey | I never have worked with the graphical dev tools (didn't even realized they existed) |
MutantTurkey | I am only using them for simple applications anyhow |
kb9vqf | A quick description of the development tools and mailing list might be nice, but other than that for now the links alone are OK |
kb9vqf | Yes, they exist(ed) |
Xu_R | and they're crap |
kb9vqf | but rapidly became a mess |
MutantTurkey | yeah |
MutantTurkey | Xu_R: I actually like gtk for small things. |
MutantTurkey | I am neither a qt or gtk guy though |
kb9vqf | I use Qt4 for small things |
MutantTurkey | I prefer good old ncurses :) |
kb9vqf | that are unlikely to grow |
Xu_R | :P |
kb9vqf | basically only for single-purpose apps that should never be expected to blend in with any DE :) |
MutantTurkey | yes |
MutantTurkey | should i link to git.trinity or scm.trinity |
kb9vqf | git.trinity |
MutantTurkey | ok |
MutantTurkey | Xu_R: lol did you see the picture at my work today? slowest shift ever. |
Xu_R | looking now... |
Xu_R | lol nice. |
MutantTurkey | finally got my glasses. |
MutantTurkey | weird to adjust |
MutantTurkey | kb9vqf: Xu_R: so far: SVN, git, devel web (wiki), roadmap, etherpad, Nightly builds, mailing list |
Xu_R | yup |
MutantTurkey | http://mutantturkey.com/contributors.html |
MutantTurkey | sorry, the page title and name is wrong, but content? |
MutantTurkey | also CSS isn't applied |
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HardDisk_WP | hey |
HardDisk_WP | i'm one of the LiMux developers of the city of Munich |
HardDisk_WP | we're using Trinity 3.5.12 and have a problem |
HardDisk_WP | when you right-click on the Home tab of the side bar, the contextmenu opens only if you click on the top ("Home") entry |
HardDisk_WP | when you right-click on the subdirectories, nothing happens |
HardDisk_WP | the other tabs (bookmarks) are not affected by this problem, right-clicking works there |
HardDisk_WP | any idea? |
Space_Man | HardDisk_WP: I'm not a Trinity developer, I'm only a user |
Space_Man | but I do remember there was some discussion of a bug that affected Konqueror |
Space_Man | the mouse right click did not work on the directories in the left hand column |
Space_Man | I think it was fixed a few months ago by samellian |
Space_Man | look in the git repo :P |
Space_Man | or ask on the mailing list |
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MutantTurkey | o/ |
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slackware_user | Hi! is it possible to install trinity on debian sid? |
MutantTurkey | slackware_user: not on slackware? |
MutantTurkey | :P |
MutantTurkey | yes it is possible! |
slackware_user | ) |
slackware_user | where to get build scripts or something? |
MutantTurkey | we provided packages |
slackware_user | for SID? |
MutantTurkey | maybe not |
MutantTurkey | isn't sid stable now? |
slackware_user | sid always unstable |
MutantTurkey | oh :x |
slackware_user | so it may be worth to make buildscripts or something |
MutantTurkey | maybe try our packages though |
MutantTurkey | it may work |
MutantTurkey | http://trinitydesktop.org/installation.php |
MutantTurkey | there are squeeze packages |
eldowan | it works great on squeeze! |
slackware_user | i try to install them now |
MutantTurkey | :) |
slackware_user | broken packages... |
slackware_user | unmet dependencies |
slackware_user | is it possible to publish build scripts for debian? |
MutantTurkey | yes. |
MutantTurkey | well for the scripts, you could ask kb9vqf |
kb9vqf | debian build files are in our GIT tree |
kb9vqf | but be forewarned we currently have gcc4.6 issues |
kb9vqf | these are being solved now |
slackware_user | ок. |
MutantTurkey | :) |
slackware_user | scripts are for svn or for releases? |
kb9vqf | you might want to use the Ubuntu Maverick build files for now |
kb9vqf | they are just the debian directories for each source folder in SVN |
kb9vqf | you have to copy the appropriate debian directory to the appropriate SVN source folder |
kb9vqf | then run dpkg-buildpackage -rfakeroot |
kb9vqf | in each source folder |
kb9vqf | this is automated on my systems, but tightly integrated with QuickBuild |
kb9vqf | so my scripts would be of no use to you |
kb9vqf | but the debian/ folders in GIT are universal |
slackware_user | ok. i ll try |
slackware_user | what's url of git repo? |
kb9vqf | hang on |
kb9vqf | |
kb9vqf | git clone http://scm.trinitydesktop.org/scm/git/tde-packaging |
kb9vqf | the debian/* build folder will only work with 3.5.12 |
slackware_user | thanx |
kb9vqf | the ubuntu/maverick/* build folder will only work with SVN |
kb9vqf | Just keep that in mind :) |
slackware_user | ok. i ll first try to build 3.5.12 |
kb9vqf | yes, updates are planned, currently in the middle of a Natty build that is draining the build system resources quite badly |
kb9vqf | ok |
slackware_user | btw how soon can be released 3.6? |
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kb9vqf | not sure yet |
kb9vqf | we're waiting on bugfixes |
kb9vqf | so it really depends on how complex they end up being |
slackware_user | ok |
kb9vqf | I'd like to see 3.5.13 released in the late fall 2001 |
kb9vqf | 2011 rather |
raevyn | Hello. Does anyone know why Pidgen wont run in Trinity? |
kb9vqf | probably an issue with the Trinity file picker |
slackware_user | btw.. after clone debian folder contains 2 folders which are empty |
kb9vqf | yes...hmmm.... |
kb9vqf | never uploaded Debian to GIT I guess :-/ |
slackware_user | ) |
kb9vqf | you can use the ubuntu/maverick_automake folder to build 3.5.12 |
raevyn | file picker? |
raevyn | is there a way to fix it? |
kb9vqf | raevyn: Try this |
kb9vqf | go to a terminal and run |
slackware_user | 2 folders with .gitignore |
raevyn | k |
kb9vqf | LD_PRELOAD= pidgin |
kb9vqf | slackware_user: ubuntu/maverick_automake is not empty on my end |
raevyn | that works! just typing pidgin gives a segmentation fault |
kb9vqf | raevyn: Then there is definitely a problem with the file picker |
kb9vqf | any chance you can get a backtrace with GDB and create a bug report? |
kb9vqf | so that it can be fixed in 3.5.13? |
slackware_user | ubuntu/maverick isnt empty |
raevyn | :( Im sorry.. if i was walked through I could |
kb9vqf | that's ok |
kb9vqf | I can do the same thing eventually |
kb9vqf | just create a bug report for now, unless one already exists |
kb9vqf | slackware_user: See http://git.trinitydesktop.org/viewgit/index.php?a=tree&p=Trinity%20Desktop%20Environment%20Packaging&h=5b9d7093413631b6975997955bef919545eca795&hb=e9b162a733491b74bd7d56edd9f1314f83a8c571 |
raevyn | okay |
kb9vqf | you must have an incomplete checkout |
raevyn | oh it has bugs reported i guess.. though nothing about using ldpreload |
kb9vqf | ok |
kb9vqf | it's a temporary fix |
kb9vqf | it works by disabling the file picker |
raevyn | <nod> bummer.. i cant make a menu item for it that way |
kb9vqf | sure |
kb9vqf | don't worry, I consider this a major/blocker bug |
raevyn | oh yay! i like pidgin WAY more than empathy |
kb9vqf | :) |
kb9vqf | It's not just pidgin |
kb9vqf | audacity also crashes |
kb9vqf | and a handful of other GTK apps |
raevyn | ohh.. is it specific gtk apps? |
slackware_user | maybe its due to sound system? |
raevyn | i am finding an oddity that maybe is realted? |
kb9vqf | it is something with the file picker handling on certain GTK apps |
kb9vqf | probably the Trinity file picker does not implement a certain GTK call |
kb9vqf | the backtrace should show that quickly |
kb9vqf | (working on grabbing one now) |
raevyn | Oh.. then it probably isnt. Graphics on GTK apps seems to like.. disapear at times. buttons and menus items until hovered over |
kb9vqf | that's probably the Qt3 integration |
slackware_user | building qt3 first? |
kb9vqf | which is a separate module altogether |
kb9vqf | slackware_user: Yes |
kb9vqf | do that from our GIT tree |
slackware_user | fails at clean... |
MutantTurkey | slackware_user: our tree |
kb9vqf | the main Qt3 branch is in the main GIT tree under main/dependencies/qt3 |
kb9vqf | it contains a debian/ folder already |
kb9vqf | IIRC |
slackware_user | ok ill try |
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raevyn | so will the new release still operate and look like ti does now? |
MutantTurkey | raevyn: yes |
raevyn | what will the new release have? O! will it have touch functionatlity? |
kb9vqf | if Xorg supports it.... |
kb9vqf | but if you want an actual "touch" OS use KDE4 |
kb9vqf | it's designed for that |
kb9vqf | or Windows 8 |
kb9vqf | Trinity is going to stay a mouse+keyboard driven DE |
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kb9vqf | lots of good alternatives for a touch driven DE |
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raevyn | ah okay. so the way it looks and runs now will stay, but bugs and such willl be fixed? |
slackware_user | libavahi-qt3-dev missing on sid |
slackware_user | where to get qt3-trinity for debian ? |
kb9vqf | yes |
kb9vqf | have to build libavahi-qt3-dev then from source... |
slackware_user | are there build scripts for these packages? |
kb9vqf | not sure |
kb9vqf | look in debian for them |
kb9vqf | that is, in the last debian release |
kb9vqf | packages.debian.org |
slackware_user | it seems that in sid that packsage was moved to repo at debian-ports.org |
slackware_user | and there is no package for both amd64 and x86 |
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calvin | wow |
calvin | kb9vqf: I am trying out kde 4.6 for first time |
calvin | just with irssi open it is using 600mb ram! |
calvin | its terribly slow. |
kb9vqf | oh nice~ |
kb9vqf | :-P |
calvin | I will admit it looks very pretty, but its lagging oddly bad. |
kb9vqf | looks nice but is unusable for work |
kb9vqf | sounds familiar |
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MutantTurkey | seems as if its indexing stuff in the backgroun alot. |
MutantTurkey | my cpu is spliking randomly |
kb9vqf | yes, that's probably nepomuk |
MutantTurkey | yes |
MutantTurkey | whatever that is. |
kb9vqf | something that cannot be turned off as an index is now somehow integral to a desktop environment (!???) |
kb9vqf | yuck |
MutantTurkey | i never used indexing |
kb9vqf | only indexer I used was Google Desktop Search |
kb9vqf | which, oddly enough, never ate my CPU or RAM! |
MutantTurkey | hurm |
kb9vqf | (it is smart enough to know when a user is active) |
MutantTurkey | this is terrible. |
MutantTurkey | it has a nice feel but even the menus and desktop are unusable. |
MutantTurkey | anyway I gotta split. just thought i'd say that. |
kb9vqf | nice feel? |
kb9vqf | I though feel was influenced by usability ;-0 |
* Xu_R notes that kde 4.7 was released today |
* Xu_R also notes that kdePIM 4.6+ is still largely unusable |
* Strangelv_ remembers integrated indexing and search. Ties up CPU and fills up all that pesky unused disk space? |
kb9vqf | No no...as the KDE4 devs would say it "Utilizes unused system resources to fulfill a needed function" |
kb9vqf | :-P |
Xu_R | XD |
* kb9vqf wouldn't use Nepomuk if it was the only indexer on the planet |
kb9vqf | Fortuantely it isn't, and I think every alternative is better :-P |
Xu_R | blehh... and I still can't believe that we need MySQL for a desktop. |
kb9vqf | we don't |
Xu_R | exactly! |
Xu_R | tell the kde4 devs that |
kb9vqf | Amarok uses it IIRC, but that is because people have music collections of thousands of tracks these days |
Xu_R | which is a good reason |
Xu_R | but for the rest of the desktop... sqlite seems so much better to me... |
kb9vqf | Amarok can use SQLite too |
kb9vqf | in fact I guess it does so by default |
kb9vqf | :eek: tornado watch + warnings near my location |
kb9vqf | not good |
Xu_R | kb9vqf: stay safe |
Xu_R | (we have tornado watch and warnings here all the time. they all seem to hit west of my area xD) |
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MutantTurkey | kb9vqf: wow. |
MutantTurkey | I just got back --- Still hogging my cpu |
MutantTurkey | kb9vqf: wow.0~that is ridiculous. |
MutantTurkey | Xu_R: actually I don't use Amarok and I still have 15,000+ songs |
MutantTurkey | its just called being organized :) |
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MutantTurkey | ~/music/artist/album/ tada! |
Xu_R | MutantTurkey: nice XP |
MutantTurkey | I do like plasma widgets :x |
MutantTurkey | they are a bit bloaty for my likening, but i do find some useful. |
Xu_R | MutantTurkey: what distro are you trying kde4 on? |
MutantTurkey | I just like the idea of embedding windows in my desktop - I have actually started implemenations of ideas for that |
MutantTurkey | Xu_R: arch. |
MutantTurkey | I had mockups for embedding windows in the root window, enver got anywhere. |
Xu_R | ah. I've always used kde4 on suse - and for some reason I can run it smoothly on 512 mb, so it got to be less of a problem than I thought |
MutantTurkey | I dunno... I have 530 ram usage right now. |
MutantTurkey | and only irssi is open |
Xu_R | damn. |
MutantTurkey | on xfce its like 150mb |
Xu_R | so bloated still... |
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hazridi | kde4 isnt that bad as of kde 4.6, it's a lot faster than it used to be |
hazridi | maybe in 2-3 years it'll be usable :P |
K`zan | OPtomist :-) |
hazridi | I'd rather use it than gnome... shiver |
MutantTurkey | this is terrible. |
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K`zan | I'd rather (and do) use gnome before kcrap4 |
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kb9vqf | Xu_R: Can you see if there is a patch to enable V4L2 support for Kopete? |
kb9vqf | in OpenSUSE, or similar distributions? |
Xu_R | sure |
kb9vqf | I may end up having to backport this http://websvn.kde.org/?view=revision&revision=738522 |
kb9vqf | and this http://websvn.kde.org/?view=revision&revision=1226213 |
kb9vqf | and a couple other minor ones |
kb9vqf | but I don't want to if I don't have to ;-) |
Xu_R | kb9vqf: nope, can't seem to find any D: |
kb9vqf | Darn |
kb9vqf | Feel up to some backporting? |
Xu_R | love to, but not atm - I've got to finish bills while my parents are out-of-town X_X |
kb9vqf | ok |
kb9vqf | I'll probably have to do it then :-P |
Xu_R | are those kde3 patches or kde4? |
kb9vqf | those are KDE34 patches |
kb9vqf | KDE4 |
kb9vqf | to relatively low level code |
kb9vqf | (meaning there isn't much reliance on Qt0 |
* kb9vqf can't type |
kb9vqf | (meaning there isn't much reliance on Qt) |
Xu_R | ah. |
kb9vqf | nevermind, there is still support for the V4L1 API available |
kb9vqf | :) |
kb9vqf | Why anyone needs V4L2 features for a webcam is beyond me! |
Xu_R | XD |
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Z_God | kb9vqf: I haven't seen any installation instructions yet for a fresh install of Trinity on Natty, would that still be useful? I could provide them if so, it's almost the same as installing fresh on Maverick. |
kb9vqf | I'm actually building Natty packages now, so you might want to wait a bit and make sure your instructions work with the new packages |
kb9vqf | I can let you know when they are available for testing |
Z_God | cool :) |
Z_God | actually I just installed the maverick packages, but I also had to add the maverick universe and maverick-updates main repository to get all the dependencies satisfied |
kb9vqf | ok |
Z_God | I also wonder if you are considering a 3.5.12 release for ubuntu lucid |
kb9vqf | not sure yet |
Z_God | most of the systems and people I support run Ubuntu Lucid with Trinity, so it would have a big impact for me ;) |
kb9vqf | gotcha |
kb9vqf | I'll see how practical that is |
Z_God | ok, what kind of problems could be there? |
Z_God | the current systems are quite stable though |
Z_God | especially when people use only trinity (which is almost always) |
kb9vqf | basically old/outdated libraries |
kb9vqf | hopefully that won't be too much of an issue |
Z_God | ok |
kb9vqf | then there is the fact that builds take a few days of computer cluster time |
kb9vqf | which uses a lot of $$$$ worth of power |
kb9vqf | :) |
kb9vqf | (by bulids I mean new builds for a new distribution) |
kb9vqf | basically a full rebuild |
Z_God | ok, an incremental upgrade doesn't make sense? |
kb9vqf | You can't just do an incremental build |
Z_God | I remember in the olden days some distros would only update kdelibs for example and then later some packages |
kb9vqf | To add 3.5.12 or 3.5.13 to a distribution you need a full rebuild |
Z_God | I'd have konqueror 2.2.1 on kde 2.2.2 for a while |
Z_God | ok |
kb9vqf | it's not good practice |
kb9vqf | it can itroduce many subtle bugs |
kb9vqf | *introduce |
kb9vqf | especially if compiler versions have changed |
kb9vqf | (which they have under Ubuntu post-release) |
Z_God | significantly? |
kb9vqf | even a minor version bump can cause problems |
kb9vqf | as I said subtle and hard to trace problems :) |
Z_God | I'd say that's a bug in the compiler though... |
kb9vqf | not really |
Z_God | but yeah I can imagine you'd rather do a full recompile then |
kb9vqf | compatibility is not guaranteed across compiler versions |
kb9vqf | not to mention if kdelibs has one class change, the entire suite must be rebuilt |
kb9vqf | we have a more agressive change policy on Trinity than on KDE3 |
kb9vqf | to make sure that the desktop stays up to date |
Z_God | I don't fully understand why it wouldn't be ABI compatible, but I know very little about this |
kb9vqf | (not for user visible elements, just for backend stuff) |
kb9vqf | In 99% of cases there would be no problem |
kb9vqf | but then I get bugs reported for the other 1% |
kb9vqf | and they are very hard to trace |
kb9vqf | Better safe than sorry IMO |
Z_God | yep, I understand |
Z_God | do you know what would be needed for the bluetooth support btw? |
Z_God | I'm running blueman now in trinity which does a pretty much perfect job |
kb9vqf | great |
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kb9vqf | !seen MutantTurkey |
tbottu | kb9vqf: MutantTurkey was last seen in #trinity-desktop 2 days, 20 hours, 22 minutes, and 41 seconds ago: <MutantTurkey> this is terrible. |
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kb9vqf | Airplane crash in Aurora disabled Internet connection for around 8 hours Sunday (07/31/2011); all services are now back online |
Xu_R | kb9vqf: wait, airplane crash? o_o so it went into the power and internet lines? |
kb9vqf | yep |
kb9vqf | complete mess |
Xu_R | my god... |
* Xu_R looks up the news |
kb9vqf | not too many pictures available |
kb9vqf | but one showed cables on the ground everywhere |
* kb9vqf notes that his luck this year is just despicable |
Xu_R | xD |
Xu_R | oh, this has it: http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/local/breaking/chi-experimental-airplane-crashes-near-aurora-airport-pilot-killed-20110731,0,816843.story |
kb9vqf | yep |
kb9vqf | that's it |
kb9vqf | although the ISP metioned that the fiber lines were cut as well |
kb9vqf | in addition to the power |
Xu_R | :-\ |
* kb9vqf wonders what's next...a hurricane? |
Xu_R | I would hope not that far north o_o |
kb9vqf | maybe 5 inches of ice :) |
Xu_R | more likely XD |
kb9vqf | any progress on fixing bugs? |
kb9vqf | there are a number of gcc4.6 fixes in SVN now, so you shouldn't have very many build problems |
Xu_R | I downloaded another copy of maverick |
Xu_R | so i'm going to re-put trinity back on there |
Xu_R | since natty builds aren't finished yet |
Xu_R | I also started re-doing the spec files for opensuse |
Xu_R | (haven't pushed them to git yet( |
Xu_R | *) |
Xu_R | man, they really overpatched kde 3.5.10 o_o |
kb9vqf | same with Qt3 |
kb9vqf | both were long overdue for a new release |
Xu_R | yea. |
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Xu_R | kb9vqf: there's no sudo-trinity for maverick? |
Xu_R | (ps - in nightly builds) |
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Piki | hi |
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Piki | i see tbottu is a little power hungry :-) |
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destroyfx | For the Etherpad, it's admin validation for the registration? |
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mutantturkey | o/ |
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kb9vqf | destroyfx: Did you attempt to register? |
kb9vqf | recently? |
destroyfx | yes, today |
kb9vqf | OK, I will approve the registration |
kb9vqf | we have to be careful of spammers |
destroyfx | ah, ok :) |
destroyfx | thanks! |
kb9vqf | np |
kb9vqf | email sent |
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mutantturkey | kb9vqf: did you import the qt3 patch you reported as a bug in the tracker? |
kb9vqf | bug number? |
mutantturkey | bug 484 |
tbottu | 04Bug http://bugs.pearsoncomputing.net/show_bug.cgi?id=484 enhancement, P5, ---, kb9vqf, NEW, Qt3 needs patching to build under ARM |
* kb9vqf goes to check |
kb9vqf | mutantturkey: Yes |
mutantturkey | okay Ill mark as fixed |
Xu_R | kb9vqf: question - do you have a working sudo-trinity for maverick in nightly builds? |
kb9vqf | did you check the build dependencies PPA? |
Xu_R | yup |
Xu_R | I only have a sudo-kde3 |
kb9vqf | ohh...oops :) |
kb9vqf | I'll correct that as soon as I can |
kb9vqf | the build farm's a bit busy right now chewing on koffice |
Xu_R | ok :P I can't install my nightly build on maverick until I have that XP |
Xu_R | ewww, koffice |
mutantturkey | LibreOffice just released 3.4.2 |
kb9vqf | odd; it let me install kdelbs/kdebase without it |
Xu_R | kb9vqf: I know... it's all installable w/o sudo-trinity >_> |
Xu_R | only ran into that when I tried to install kdpkg-trinity, which wants sudo-trinity |
kb9vqf | yes, that makes sense |
kb9vqf | poke me tomorrow about it :) |
kb9vqf | too busy today |
Xu_R | ok |
kb9vqf | I can't believe how many "programmers" thought code was OK that now throws this |
kb9vqf | error: for a function-style cast, remove the redundant '::QPen' |
kb9vqf | :-P |
mutantturkey | kb9vqf: low quality control, thats how they release so fast. |
kb9vqf | it would never occur to me to write code like this TQString::TQString("Hi!") |
kb9vqf | oh well |
mutantturkey | and release cylces are speeding up. |
kb9vqf | so that's the excuse for Windows 8? :-) |
mutantturkey | KDE3 was in functionality for quite a while. KDE4 is already at 4.8... 5 is in planning stages |
kb9vqf | and it's still a bloated unusable pile of garbage |
kb9vqf | nice |
mutantturkey | or at least qt5 is in planning by nokia |
mutantturkey | yeah basically. |
mutantturkey | honestly, I think windows is doing some good with 8. |
mutantturkey | It is at least standardizing and forcing them to use open technologies |
Xu_R | have you seen Meego? |
mutantturkey | because then all windows apps will run on all platforms |
kb9vqf | inferior tech nonetheless |
kb9vqf | even if it is open |
mutantturkey | kb9vqf: obviously. but either way Idon't use windows |
kb9vqf | :) |
Xu_R | people say everything is good if it's open-source. it's not good if it's open-source + crap :P |
mutantturkey | Xu_R: but the open source model is superioir |
mutantturkey | to the closed source |
mutantturkey | in most cases. |
kb9vqf | KDE4 is proving you wrong |
kb9vqf | ;) |
Xu_R | true - but the quality of the software is something to think about XD |
mutantturkey | kb9vqf: now imagine if KDE4 was closed source. it would be 50x worse |
kb9vqf | yes, I know, I know |
kb9vqf | it seems that the worst traits of both models are on display lately |
Xu_R | I wish Nokia didn't scrap Meego for Windows Phone... >_> |
kb9vqf | I know |
Xu_R | because people hate Windows Phone but love Meego |
Xu_R | and yet it's dead on arrival to stores |
mutantturkey | I like the windows phone... |
mutantturkey | The interface is actually clean and intuitive. |
mutantturkey | compared to apple and android |
mutantturkey | I really need a clean interface, and a really well integrated one (which is one thing i hate about linux...) |
kb9vqf | evil thought...M$ probably thinks that the desktop is disappearing and they want to write their apps once and have them work on both the software-as-a-service Web stuff and their "desktop OS" |
Xu_R | xD |
kb9vqf | hence the emphasis on web technologies |
Xu_R | desktop OS... there's no way I'm moving to windows 8 |
* kb9vqf will never EVER rent space on other people's mainframes |
kb9vqf | too great a liklihood the other party makes your vital data inacecssable at some point |
mutantturkey | i dont trust the cloud. |
kb9vqf | s/mainframes/software-as-a-service cloud/g ;) |
kb9vqf | this is all old tech |
kb9vqf | old ideas |
mutantturkey | anyway |
kb9vqf | back on topic? ;-) |
Xu_R | maybe ;P |
mutantturkey | back on topic? I am really annoyed with the fact that I can't get kde3 working and I don't have time to work on it. I am debating about installing debian in a chroot just to work with it |
kb9vqf | Xu_R: How are your spec files coming |
kb9vqf | mutantturkey: Which distribution do you use? |
Xu_R | kb9vqf: working on it, may run builds locally soon, but not right this second. still a mess xP |
mutantturkey | Arch... |
kb9vqf | ok |
kb9vqf | understandable |
mutantturkey | I don't want to compromise either way. |
mutantturkey | i want arch + trinity. :P |
mutantturkey | wish david was still around. He actually understands building on arch |
kb9vqf | try the mailing list |
kb9vqf | sometimes people take breaks |
kb9vqf | it's healthy to do so :) |
mutantturkey | good thinking |
mutantturkey | I need to take a good stab at it. |
mutantturkey | I am hoping a night this week I can sit down with a few hours and work |
destroyfx | I'm thinking about making Trinity ebuild for Funtoo and Gentoo |
mutantturkey | destroyfx: that would be sweet |
Xu_R | samelian was working on that with kde-sunset, I think? |
mutantturkey | we have a trinity packaging repo |
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mutantturkey | destroyfx: git clone http://scm.trinitydesktop.org/scm/git/tde-packaging if you are intrested |
mutantturkey | I don't think we have any for gentoo now. so someone working on it would be cool |
destroyfx | what tde-packaging? |
mutantturkey | it's where we keep all our build scripts for distros |
kb9vqf | it contains all distribution-specific packaging files, ready to be copied into the vanilla Trinity source |
destroyfx | For kde-sunset, I hear that the ebuild was planed but are actually canceled. Only KDE 3.5.10 are present |
kb9vqf | yes, they suggested using a new ebuild |
destroyfx | ah, ok :p I will chack that this evening |
destroyfx | I just made some patch for KDE 3.5.10 in kde-submit... Because of some ::Stupid(error) preventing some packages to compile in GCC 4.5 |
kb9vqf | there are a number of gcc4.5/gcc4.6 fixes in the Trinity SVN |
kb9vqf | http://www.trinitydesktop.org/patches/ |
destroyfx | yeah, I read that. But I will need to make a ton of ebuilds first prior to use |
kb9vqf | sure |
kb9vqf | just wanted to let you know they were there |
kb9vqf | :) |
jumpship | Is anyone using Debian Squeeze with trinity and have KDE4 installed to use some of the KDE4 programs? |
kb9vqf | I have some experience with KDE4 installed alongside Trinity under Ubuntu |
jumpship | I don't wanna break trinity, so I've been trying to hold off with some programs, is the stable pkgs of trinity pretty safe with KDE4 alongside? |
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mutantturkey | kb9vqf: I see a commit revision (r1242480) saying that everything has been completely moved to .trinity and /etc/trinity? |
kb9vqf | yep |
kb9vqf | the old kde3 prefix is now dropped |
kb9vqf | otherwise it's just too confusing |
kb9vqf | depending on which distribution you use it could be ~/.kde, ~/.kde3, or ~/.trinity |
kb9vqf | a simple 'mv ~/.kde3 ~/.trinity' will work |
kb9vqf | I will probably have to detect the .kde3 directory for a while still |
kb9vqf | in startkde |
kb9vqf | but all new installs will put the profile in ~/.trinity |
mutantturkey | maybe a migration script |
mutantturkey | when 3.5.13 is released |
kb9vqf | probably |
mutantturkey | might be easier to leave it up to users |
kb9vqf | yes |
mutantturkey | so what about bugs like 459? |
kb9vqf | Trinity still obeys KDEHOME |
kb9vqf | bug 459? |
tbottu | 04Bug http://bugs.pearsoncomputing.net/show_bug.cgi?id=459 blocker, P1, ---, kb9vqf, NEW, Detecting $KDEHOME to avoid conflicts with KDE3 and KDE4 |
kb9vqf | ah |
mutantturkey | does KDE4 use $KDEHOME also? |
kb9vqf | yes |
kb9vqf | I thought that bug was fixed |
kb9vqf | hmmm |
mutantturkey | It might be, I was just browsing |
kb9vqf | startkde should search in this order: ~/.trinity, ~/.kde3, ~/.kde |
kb9vqf | and should only create ~/.trinity |
mutantturkey | so what about this situation: |
kb9vqf | in fact, IMHO, it shouldn't even look for ~/.kde |
mutantturkey | someone has kde4 previously, so .kde is there , then they install trinity, then what? |
kb9vqf | see above :) |
mutantturkey | but they don't have .trinity on first run. |
kb9vqf | right |
kb9vqf | startkde should search in this order: ~/.trinity, ~/.kde3 |
kb9vqf | and ignore ~/.kde |
mutantturkey | Agreed. |
kb9vqf | if ~/.trinity and ~/.kde3 don't exist then it should create ~/.trinity |
kb9vqf | s/and/or/g |
mutantturkey | that sounds valid |
mutantturkey | eventually.. very distant future drop .kde3 |
kb9vqf | right |
kb9vqf | but at this point NEVER EVER create a ~/.kde3 directory :) |
kb9vqf | I haven't looked in startkde recently |
kb9vqf | so I don't know how much of that logic is already in place |
kb9vqf | I know some of it is |
kb9vqf | but not all of it |
mutantturkey | okay |
mutantturkey | should I mark that bug with anything? |
kb9vqf | it must block KDE 3.5.13 |
kb9vqf | and you might want to append the logic described above |
kb9vqf | regarding searching |
kb9vqf | Oh, this is fun: on Natty, how do you like this library path location: /lib/i386-linux-gnu/libdbus-1.so |
kb9vqf | ick ick ick |
mutantturkey | why! |
mutantturkey | thats terrible |
mutantturkey | ubuntu is moving farther away from linux every release. |
mutantturkey | and is completely devoid of the unix philosophy |
kb9vqf | I have no idea |
kb9vqf | All I can say is YUCK |
kb9vqf | that's even worse than the lib/ vs lib64/ stuff |
kb9vqf | fortunately it only broke k9copy |
kb9vqf | and I think I fixed that |
Xu_R | o_o |
mutantturkey | i know. |
mutantturkey | well /lib32/ i am okay with. |
mutantturkey | because Arch has a really simple way to setup 32bit on 64bit machines |
kb9vqf | yes, but there should still be a symlink from /lib to /lib32 then |
kb9vqf | or /lib64 depending on the machine architecture |
mutantturkey | it's just an extra repo, and that's it. |
mutantturkey | kb9vqf: yep |
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mutantturkey | kb9vqf: funny enough he just posted on the arch ml about trinity |
mutantturkey | David that is |
kb9vqf | only good things I hope? ;-) |
mutantturkey | just some package error conflict, easily resolved |
mutantturkey | i took it as an opportunity to email him |
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mutantturkey | kb9vqf: heading out. I am looking at some bugs tonight. might be on later. |
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destroyfx | it's okay if I repackage all the file in .bz2 format and if I put the correct directory name. exemple, when I unpack kdelibs-3.5.12.tar.gz, I must get the kdelibs-3.5.12 folder instead of a plain kdelibs folder |
destroyfx | I can mirror them too (all your packages plus those I will make) |
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raevyn | Hai :) Im using the shell to start Pidgin but everytime I close it, Pidgin closes as well. Is there some way to like, start it and then let me close the shell without losing pidgin? |
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Space_Man | I think you can add && after pidgin |
Space_Man | pidgin && |
kb9vqf | pidgin & |
kb9vqf | exit |
kb9vqf | also, there is a fix in SVN for this...if you are feeling adventurous you can install the nightly builds for Maverick or Natty.... |
raevyn | thank you! |
kb9vqf | np |
raevyn | oh i might.. i was going to ask, when i loaded kde 3 on my machine, i already loaded kde 4 and now, my menu is goofy. is there a way to reset my menu? |
kb9vqf | menu is goofy? |
kb9vqf | how so? |
kb9vqf | screenshots may help here :) |
raevyn | okay well, if i log in as another user, the menu will show what app is kde 3 and kde 4, such as the control panel. but in mine it doesnt so some items start with the kde4 interface rather than 3 |
raevyn | oh okay.. i will try to get screenshots tonight for you :) |
raevyn | Im at work right now so I can chat but not really do anything too intensive |
raevyn | How would i install the build? Im not super savvy in linux yet so I used your instructions to get it on Ubuntu 10.10. |
* Xu_R nudges at kb9vqf for missing sudo-trinity in the nightlys |
kb9vqf | Xu_R: It was uploaded last night to the nightly build dependencies |
Xu_R | ok - checking now |
kb9vqf | raevyn: First I would back up your machine ;-) |
kb9vqf | Then you can swap out the nightly build repository deb and deb-src lines in your /etc/apt/sources.list file |
kb9vqf | hmmm...on second thought, there are missing metapackages in that repository ATM |
kb9vqf | so you can't really upgrade |
raevyn | :) always good practice. |
raevyn | oh.. well then.. i guess i will wait :P |
kb9vqf | sorry |
kb9vqf | new installs are OK |
kb9vqf | upgrades need metapackages that are not yet uploaded |
* kb9vqf forgot about that since he installed Trinity from scratch on his development machines |
* Xu_R is about to do the kde3 -> trinity deadly upgrade from stable -> nightly XD |
Xu_R | kb9vqf: I don't see sudo-trinity still D: |
raevyn | is that disc that is made with trinity Ubuntu, just no gnome? I would like to have the hardware checking and easy software installation of ubuntu but use TDE is all |
Xu_R | strange. I see it right on mirror.tokra.lv... |
Xu_R | well... that's strange. |
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kb9vqf | Xu_R: Mirrors may not have synced yet |
kb9vqf | they are on a 24 hour cycle |
kb9vqf | so I would wait until tomorrow |
Xu_R | kb9vqf: I just downloaded sudo-trinity from the mirror, it's just not in the repo meta yet... |
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kb9vqf | be careful...some of those pacakges are for Debian.... |
kb9vqf | *packages |
Xu_R | ah, true. |
* Xu_R forgot that you built for debian way back before .-." |
kb9vqf | and will build for Debian again... |
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MutantTurkey | Xu_R: what's up man |
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Xu_R | hey MutantTurkey |
Xu_R | ah, damnit. lost him by a few minutes |
Xu_R | kb9vqf: I see a sudo-trinity for maverick! :D |
kb9vqf | ah, good :) |
Xu_R | looks like the repo meta is also refreshd |
kb9vqf | so now I should see some bugfixes soon? ;-) |
Xu_R | *refreshed |
Xu_R | indeed |
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Xu_R|ZNC | kb9vqf: before I head out for tennis: I see a python-dcop and python-kde3 fof kde3, but not for trinity... |
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kb9vqf | not surprised...those packages are a mess and it may take some time before I build them |
Xu_R | ah, ok |
kb9vqf | they are also not needed for 99% of Trinity apps |
Xu_R | ok |
* kb9vqf is NOT a Python guru and is seriously considering dropping them from the Ubuntu builds if they don't work out of the box |
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Xu_R | back from tennis - downpour started as soon as I got to the courts >_> |
Xu_R | kb9vqf: a lot of packages are missing from the mirrors o_o |
kb9vqf | ? |
kb9vqf | like what? |
Xu_R | kdm, ksplash, kdebase, etc |
Xu_R | they're not on mirror.tokra.lv or associated >_> so apt-get is failing to download them D: |
kb9vqf | ah, ok |
kb9vqf | every night my ISP has been severing the connection |
Xu_R | ah... that's probably why... |
kb9vqf | so it is very probable that the files were not transferred yet |
Xu_R | quite a few: http://slexy.org/view/s20dcKvDfP |
kb9vqf | on the plus side the weather should be quiet for a while here, which should aid in keeping the connection up |
Xu_R | that's good :D |
kb9vqf | I'm not going to do anything about it (because I can't) |
kb9vqf | but if you are still having problems in a day or two please let me know\ |
Xu_R | ok |
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Xu_R | blehh... I had to install xfce4 to remove kde3 and install trinity... >_> |
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Xu_R | and kdm seems to be stalling after logout... and rejecting upstart restart/stop/start/etc requests.... |
Xu_R | (fking upstart... it's not even maintained anymore) |
Xu_R | kdm session menu shows KDE3 instead of trinity... |
Xu_R | looks like kdesudo for trinity isn't right... |
Xu_R | kdm's theme isn't made properly... |
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Xu_R | kb9vqf: I got the nightly installed |
Xu_R | :D |
Xu_R | and am already having difficulties... :-\ |
Xu_R | kb9vqf: http://trinity.etherpad.trinitydesktop.org/8 |
kb9vqf | Xu_R: Not surprised; this is not release quality software yet! |
kb9vqf | in particular I know that the default themes are not available |
kb9vqf | they have not been uploaded yet |
Xu_R | figured that most of this was expected :P |
kb9vqf | also, DO NOT TRY TO UPGRADE A SYSTEM THAT HAS ANY *-kde3 packages INSTALLED ON IT |
kb9vqf | install from a clean Maverick/Natty installation ONLY |
kb9vqf | metapackages will be available to migrate from the -kde3 package suffix as the release date nears |
kb9vqf | but not yet :) |
Xu_R | kb9vqf: bit too late, I did the upgrade... :-\ |
kb9vqf | well, now I don't know where your problems are coming from :-\ |
Xu_R | D: |
kb9vqf | could be the code, could be old -kde3 packages |
kb9vqf | you will have to manually purge all -kde3 packages |
Xu_R | oh, I already purged all the -kde3 packages |
kb9vqf | the kdesudo thing sounds irritating |
Xu_R | it is D: |
kb9vqf | knetworkmanager sounds like a kde3/trinity change |
kb9vqf | that is, it broke in the move from .kde3 and /etc/kde3 to .trinity and //etc/trinity |
kb9vqf | why is networkmanager upstream missing VPN support??? |
Xu_R | it probably is... but mind you, for some reason the -trinity packages are still using my .kde3 settings |
Xu_R | no, i'm saying knetworkmanager is not working with the VPN support |
Xu_R | (did I mistype that? O_O) |
kb9vqf | yes |
Xu_R | yikes |
Xu_R | lemme fix that |
Xu_R | there... |
kb9vqf | ok |
kb9vqf | anything else to add to the list of bad news? |
Xu_R | not really, which is a good thing. i'm firing up a clean install to see if I get the same stuff |
kb9vqf | also any work that you can do to track down the cause of those problems is greatly appreciated :) |
kb9vqf | ok |
kb9vqf | sounds good |
kb9vqf | Xu_R: Profile directory name (~/.trinity) fixes are in SVN revision 1244723. |
kb9vqf | you can directly patcth the /opt/trinity/bin/startkde file if you don't want to wait for the nightly builds |
Xu_R | ok |
kb9vqf | let me know if it works properly please :) |
Xu_R | sure |
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MutantTurkey | kb9vqf: Xu_R: running a chroot of debian in my arch |
MutantTurkey | going okay so far |
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Xu_R | oh grrr.... I just realized |
Xu_R | there's absolutely no polkit dialog when using trinity |
Xu_R | so apps that depend on polkit |
Xu_R | just... fail. |
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Necrosporus | What's about trinity for Slackware 13.37? |
kb9vqf | ask on the trinity-devel mailing list |
kb9vqf | I don't handle Slackware |
kb9vqf | but the person who does is on the list |
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Necrosporus | Well, so I will probably have to compile it myself. I doubt, however, if it worth it |
Necrosporus | Xfce works |
Necrosporus | And I'm not sure, if KDE4 is still not as good as 3.5 |
Necrosporus | There was a security bugs in Konqueror, is it fixed in Trinity? |
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Strangelv__ | "Have the bug reports been enterede into TDE's bug tracker? |
Necrosporus | I do not know, I just read, there was a vulnerability of SSL certificate checking if it contain null symbols |
Necrosporus | It was discovered after release of 3.5.10, if I remember it correctly |
TokRa | IMHO, KDE4 is good enough except Plasma and its sick addiction to mysql based akonadi |
* TokRa uses Gnome2 as DE, KDE3.Kmail and KDE3.Kate for mails and code editing, KDE4.Konqueror as file manager |
TokRa | Gnome is not customisable enough :( |
kb9vqf | we have many CVE updates from after 3.5.10 in our codebase |
kb9vqf | as long as it was patched on at least one major distro (such as RedHat) we likely have the patches already in place |
kb9vqf | a link to the CVE or upstream bug always helps ;-) |
kb9vqf | also, if xfce is powerful enough for you, stick with it |
kb9vqf | Trinity is here for those who find xfce too limiting |
kb9vqf | KDE4 too bloated |
kb9vqf | and Gnome 3 too limited |
kb9vqf | :) |
kb9vqf | that should be 'and Gnome 3 too childish' |
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Necrosporus | Well, I seem to use mostly terminal, firefox and some games |
Necrosporus | What' s about Gnome 2 and Unity? |
Necrosporus | I have used KDE 3.5.9 for a year, because of Slackware 12.1, however, times changed, I bought a netbook, and installed ubuntu 10.04 on it |
Necrosporus | So, I stick mostly with gnome2, at first I found it too limited of configuration, but adapted somehow later |
TokRa | Unity is especially designed for kids and mentally challenged adults |
TokRa | IMHO |
TokRa | completely unusable |
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Necrosporus | Does Gnome3 differ much? |
Necrosporus | I have tried it from livecd, haven't found many difference |
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TokRa | It does |
Necrosporus | What's the main difference, beside, the side panel is visible only in menu mode? |
aalecs | gnome sucks. the only thing good in gnome is gdm |
Revan199 | gedit? file-roller? |
Revan199 | brasero? |
aalecs | xarchiver, mucommander, xfburn.. |
Revan199 | gedit not a FM |
Revan199 | it is a text editor |
aalecs | geany then |
aalecs | i know what gedit is |
Space_Man | gparted? |
Revan199 | gedit is better for text than Geany, of course |
aalecs | uh, that is ok, but we also have qtparted |
Revan199 | it is a really good text editor |
aalecs | Revan199: if you tweak geany, it has a lot of good stuff |
Revan199 | aalecs: I don't need an IDE then I edit a plain text |
aalecs | Revan199: leafpad then. |
Revan199 | and I don't need to not use gedit |
Revan199 | aalecs: gedit better %) |
Space_Man | sadly qtparted is not available for kubuntu 9.10 |
aalecs | Space_Man: pack it then. build your own deb |
aalecs | Revan199: mousepad then :D |
Revan199 | aalecs: ? |
Space_Man | hopefully in the next day or two I will be updating to something a bit newer |
aalecs | sincerily, the best de are xfce and kde |
aalecs | gnome is a sucko.. |
aalecs | Revan199: mousepad is the text editor in xfce |
Revan199 | aalecs: but that don't mean that every program in GNOME sucks? |
aalecs | nope, not all programs. but as a de gnome sucks :D and i just hate the fact that all the dumbasses started using linux, and distros like fedora... |
aalecs | where has lfs gone |
aalecs | debian netinstall.. slack.. where |
Revan199 | my debootstrap'd ubuntu don't have DE |
aalecs | cool. why did u choose ubuntu and not debian ? |
Revan199 | aalecs: I'm switched FROM debian to ubuntu :-D |
aalecs | ok, but why ? |
Revan199 | PPA? |
aalecs | i'm on altlinux here |
aalecs | but also use debian and centos |
Revan199 | ALTLinux? why not Agilia? |
Revan199 | AgiliaLinux is a nice distro =) |
Revan199 | but I don't think that ALT is nice too |
aalecs | well, i'm on alt since 2004 |
aalecs | better said, i`m on alt since it was a mdk fork |
Revan199 | well, my first distro is... Debian |
aalecs | my first was rh 6.0 |
Revan199 | heh |
aalecs | and after that slack, mdk and a lot others |
aalecs | but mainly alt now |
aalecs | and debian/others as virtual stuff, vbox, xen, openvz |
Revan199 | when I tried ALT I thought that it is a big pack of crap |
aalecs | why ? |
Revan199 | aalecs: whell... I don't remember why (my memory... %)) |
aalecs | well, i don't think it's crap |
aalecs | :) |
Revan199 | =) |
Revan199 | I remember that updating from 4 to 5 removed all files |
aalecs | ure joking :)) |
Revan199 | xarchiver not better than file-roller %) |
Revan199 | aalecs: no |
Revan199 | I don't |
aalecs | file-roller is good. xarchiver is ok. |
aalecs | peazip works too. |
Revan199 | peazip just works, but it doesn't work good |
TokRa | Linus Torvalds to fork Gnome2: https://plus.google.com/106327083461132854143/posts/SbnL3KaVRtM |
Revan199 | TokRa: he is funny yea |
TokRa | Timothy has forked KDE3, so why Linus couldn't do the same thing with Gnome2? :D |
Revan199 | TokRa: he don't know how to use google but wrote a post in plus.google.com |
* TokRa doesn't use social networks at all |
Revan199 | because if he can use google he can googled http://matsusoft.com.ar/redmine/projects/mate |
aalecs | eh. gnome sucks. and qmail sucks too. |
Revan199 | aalecs: who is qmail? |
aalecs | google it |
Revan199 | %) |
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Necrosporus | Gedit is not good |
Necrosporus | kwrite is much better |
TokRa | kate is godlike anyway |
TokRa | ^_^ |
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kb9vqf | equipment swap in progress...service should be restored by 3:30PM CDT |
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Xu_R | kb9vqf: Just realized - there's no native polkit dialog for trinity... |
Xu_R | so if I launched an application that needed polkit, it would fail because of no native dialog D: |
kb9vqf | polkit? |
Xu_R | polkit = PolicyKit |
Xu_R | (example - Ubuntu Software Center) |
kb9vqf | hmmm...for now I would just install some other policykit dialog |
kb9vqf | e.g. the gnome one |
kb9vqf | since Trinity doesn't use policykit at all |
Xu_R | I have the GNOME one, however polkit refuses to invoke it on Trinity |
Xu_R | I put XFCE on the same VM to see - polkit works there, so I'm not sure why polkit is refusing |
kb9vqf | do you get any console messages? |
* kb9vqf notes that the Qt3 version of a policykit dialog is here https://gitorious.org/policykit-kde |
kb9vqf | Qt4 rather |
Xu_R | hmm |
Xu_R | console messages: |
Xu_R | damnit, i didn't install vbox additions |
Xu_R | going to have to type it up |
Xu_R | softwarecenter.backend - WARNING - _on_trans_error: org.freedesktop.PolicyKit.Error.Failed: ('system-bus-name', {'name': ':1.32'}): org.debian.apt.install-or-remove-packages |
* kb9vqf is guessing that the daemon that monitors DBUS doesn't start automaticallly under Trinity |
kb9vqf | that is a stupid design IMHO |
Xu_R | polkit is stupid because not everyone uses it >_> so in the end, it's another flaw |
kb9vqf | let's see...we'll just have YET ANOTHER BACKGROUND PROCESS running 24/7 in case someone wants to...launch with administrative privileges??? |
kb9vqf | :-P |
Xu_R | XD |
Xu_R | ughhh |
Xu_R | update-manager |
Xu_R | it now uses polkit |
Xu_R | and guess what? it just fails silently (not even console messages) |
kb9vqf | see if you can find the process under XFCE |
* kb9vqf needs to restart something; be back in a few minutes |
Xu_R | ok |
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Xu_R | kb9vqf: oh, good lord. there's policykit-1-gnome and polkit-kde-1 that handle the dialogs |
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kb9vqf | ok, I'm back |
Xu_R | kb9vqf: oh, good lord. there's policykit-1-gnome and polkit-kde-1 that handle the dialogs... According to the description: 'PolicyKit-gnome provies a D-Bus session bus service that is used to bring up authentication dialogs used for obtaining privileges.' |
kb9vqf | all services should be up |
kb9vqf | yep |
kb9vqf | isn't it stupid? |
Xu_R | sigh. |
kb9vqf | what in the world was wrong with sudo? |
Xu_R | nothing, which makes this even more crazy |
kb9vqf | Ubuntu only? |
Xu_R | because sudo can do the same exact thing with fine-grained privileges |
ar | kb9vqf: nothing, except it's not flexible |
Xu_R | uhh... probably not just Ubuntu |
kb9vqf | so polkit is actually better? |
Xu_R | depends how you look at it |
* kb9vqf doesn't like things running in the background |
Xu_R | I see polkit and sudo the same in the end, just polkit is fancier -_-" |
ar | kb9vqf: you either give a user "user ALL=(ALL) ALL" or end up with dozens of sudoers rules |
kb9vqf | right... |
kb9vqf | does polkit have a configuration GUI? |
Xu_R | debian, fedora, and probably some other distributions will run into these polkit problems, AFAIK because they use tools with polkit now |
Xu_R | uhhh... polkit gui? used to be, I dunno now |
ar | and afair the point of polkit was that only a part of an app could get elevated privileges, which isn't the case with sudo |
Xu_R | ar: makes me wonder what happened with gksu-polkit development |
kb9vqf | part of an app? |
kb9vqf | now that seems just ridiculous to me |
Xu_R | kb9vqf: it's like running synaptic not as root |
kb9vqf | now we have who knows how many dangling security holes resulting from slicing off part of an app |
Xu_R | but then when you hit apply it asks for root permissions to do just that |
kb9vqf | so it is more of a temporal elevation? |
Xu_R | yes |
kb9vqf | that is the entire app gets root access for a small amount of time |
kb9vqf | ok |
kb9vqf | that makes more sense |
kb9vqf | personally I say use some other GUI frontend to polkit |
kb9vqf | there is no need to have the Trinity widget styles |
kb9vqf | for a stupid password box :) |
Xu_R | xD except that stupid password box won't launch under trinity |
Xu_R | >_> |
kb9vqf | of course |
kb9vqf | the question is why |
kb9vqf | and whose problem is it? |
kb9vqf | ours? |
kb9vqf | or is polkit detecting KDE3 and not launching? |
Xu_R | I think polkit is detecting KDE3 and not launching... |
kb9vqf | then that's not our problem |
kb9vqf | :-P |
kb9vqf | next question: can it be fooled into thinking it is running under Gnome/XFCE/etc |
Xu_R | I don't know... |
kb9vqf | feel like figuring that out for me? :) |
* Xu_R goes to google |
kb9vqf | hehe |
kb9vqf | the odd thing is that it worked under Maverick |
kb9vqf | I got the ugly Gnome popup when I lauched Synaptic |
Xu_R | Synaptic doesn't use polkit |
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Dexter_F | heya |
Xu_R | hey, look what I found! /usr/libexec/polkit-gnome-authentication-agent-1 |
Dexter_F | I need kaffeine-kde3 only on one box that does not have/need trinity and runs debian wheezy - I guess there are no precompiled packages for that? |
Xu_R | for wheezy? not right now D: |
Xu_R | kb9vqf: the auth agent for gnome isn't running under trinity |
kb9vqf | and if you manually start it do things work? |
Xu_R | trying to find the binary to start it |
Xu_R | ubuntu moved things around |
Xu_R | hmm |
Xu_R | ok, so it's only set to start in gnome... |
Xu_R | '/ETC/XDG/AUTOSTART/POLKIT-GNOME-AUTHENTICATION-AGENT-1.DESKTOP' |
Xu_R | (sorry for the capitals) |
Xu_R | ok |
Xu_R | lemme test this out... |
Xu_R | it works |
Xu_R | so, yea... |
Xu_R | you need another background process to display the dialogs >_> |
Xu_R | the binary controlling this: '/usr/lib/policykit-1-gnome/polkit-gnome-authentication-agent-1 |
Xu_R | ; |
Xu_R | *' |
kb9vqf | well, that is definitely a problem |
kb9vqf | I hate that design |
kb9vqf | but I guess I have to live with it for now |
kb9vqf | so we'll need a /ETC/XDG/AUTOSTART/POLKIT-TRINITY-AUTHENTICATION-AGENT-1.DESKTOP with nearly identical contents that depends on the package including /ETC/XDG/AUTOSTART/POLKIT-GNOME-AUTHENTICATION-AGENT-1.DESKTOP |
kb9vqf | :-P |
Xu_R | yea |
Xu_R | and they need to have OnlyShowIn=TDE; or something... |
kb9vqf | right |
kb9vqf | thats the "nearly identical contents" mentioned above ;-) |
Xu_R | ;P |
kb9vqf | <rant>Linux is becoming more like the bad part of Windows merged with the bad UI of UNIX and the childish UI of Mac all rolled into one</rant> |
Xu_R | but is the 'TDE' part recognizable? |
Xu_R | kb9vqf: +1 |
kb9vqf | hmmm...it might be recognizable, not sure |
kb9vqf | can you try it? |
kb9vqf | if it doesn't launch then try OnlyShowIn=KDE |
Xu_R | ok |
Xu_R | let's seee... |
Xu_R | nope, TDE doesn't work |
Xu_R | o_O |
Xu_R | KDE doesn't work either... |
Xu_R | kb9vqf: is Trinity reading /etc/xdg/autostart? |
kb9vqf | it *should* |
kb9vqf | try it without the OnlyShowIn just for fun |
kb9vqf | barring that, you could try creating an entry in /opt/trinity/etc/xdg/autostart/ |
Xu_R | without the OnlyShowIn it works |
Xu_R | o_o" |
kb9vqf | hmmm |
kb9vqf | OnlyShowIn=KDE3? |
kb9vqf | if that works then something old snuck through |
Xu_R | dum dum dum. |
Xu_R | no, KDE3 doesn't work |
Xu_R | o_o" |
kb9vqf | huh |
* kb9vqf goes to look at kdebase |
Xu_R | something slipped through... >_>" |
kb9vqf | Well it is supposed to be OnlyShowIn=KDE; |
kb9vqf | Xu_R: Is there a NotShowIn field? |
Xu_R | no |
Xu_R | hmm... interesting, because adept notifier is also in /etc/xdg/autostart and it has OnlyShowIn=KDE; |
Xu_R | I'm going to try again with KDE |
kb9vqf | right |
kb9vqf | something must be confusing it |
Xu_R | hey, this time it works.... |
Xu_R | >_>" |
Xu_R | brb, dinner... |
kb9vqf | Xu_R: X-TDE-Autostart* support is now in SVN revision 1245190. |
kb9vqf | X-TDE-Autostart* is preferred, but it will fall back to X-KDE-Autostart* if needed |
Xu_R | ok |
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kb9vqf | Xu_R: KDM session name moved from KDE3 to TDE in SVN revision 1245194. |
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Xu_R | kb9vqf: :D |
Xu_R | kb9vqf: Question: Is it possible for the kickoff menu icon to just be a Trinity logo icon? |
Xu_R | (and we have to get rid of that embedded image stuff, that's uglyyy) |
kb9vqf | I'm not going to fight with it personally as I never use Kickoff |
kb9vqf | if you want to try to fix it send me a patch :) |
Xu_R | eek - ok, I'll see what I cando |
kb9vqf | ok |
Xu_R | kb9vqf: on the About Trinity dialog, the name is still "About KDE" |
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kb9vqf | Xu_R: That was fixed about an hour ago |
Xu_R | oh, ok :P |
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Xu_R | kb9vqf: can I close bug 459? because you've moved everything to .trinity already |
tbottu | 04Bug http://bugs.pearsoncomputing.net/show_bug.cgi?id=459 blocker, P1, ---, kb9vqf, NEW, Detecting $KDEHOME to avoid conflicts with KDE3 and KDE4 |
kb9vqf | It *should* be fixed |
kb9vqf | but I would verify it before closing that bug!! |
Xu_R | ok |
MutantTurkey | awesome! |
MutantTurkey | did you se the libpython2.6 bug? |
Xu_R | the libpython2.6 bug I had also before - but I would call that bad ubuntu packaging |
Xu_R | and not trinity's problem... |
Xu_R | kb9vqf: patched startkde... |
Xu_R | and it works! |
Xu_R | my .kde3 moved to .trinity |
Xu_R | and I still have all my settings |
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Xu_R | kb9vqf: I can confirm. |
Xu_R | and looks like the rest of the bug has already been done |
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kb9vqf | ok |
kb9vqf | go ahead and close it then |
Xu_R | closed already :P |
Xu_R | hm, breaking news just popped up.. |
Xu_R | "Rating agency Standard & Poor's says it has downgraded the U.S. credit rating to AA+ from its top rank of AAA. " |
Xu_R | oh, who didn't see that coming.. .>_> |
kb9vqf | ok |
kb9vqf | and not good :-P |
Xu_R | nope :P |
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KingSphinx | So the channel does exist... :P |
Xu_R | ... |
KingSphinx | Sorry, actually just thought I'd drop by this channel to give a few words of praise, for lack of a better term, to this project for having the guts to maintain the former incarnation of KDE. Bravo! |
KingSphinx | To be honest, I never used KDE until... 4.2, I think? I have no hard feelings against the Plasma Desktop, but 3.x just feels... right, you know? Anyhoo, if I'm bothering anyone, sorry... |
kb9vqf | no, not bothering us at all :) |
kb9vqf | we like it when users stop by to tell us they like what we are doing |
kb9vqf | and in your case especially we can point to someone who had no predjudice against KDE4 (since KDE4 was your first experience with KDE), which means that the KDE3 style is still superior for some percentage of new Linux users :) |
kb9vqf | thanks for going out of your way to let us know you like the project! |
KingSphinx | I really don't understand why they felt the need to drop Kicker entirely, it was ported to Qt4 and everything, but droppped in alpha IIRC. It would've been nice for them to have left it as an optional component or something. :/ |
KingSphinx | However, Trinity's indirectly responsible for my migration to Fedora (broke Compiz and my display driver with it) |
kb9vqf | I don't think it was fully ported |
kb9vqf | Qt4 was too limited to handle the "old" Kicker internals |
KingSphinx | It was fine until I tried to experiment with Compiz though, so I harbor no ill will towards it. |
kb9vqf | use fusion-icon |
kb9vqf | and Ubuntu itself is....ehmm...unstable when it comes to Compiz |
kb9vqf | regardless of the DE you use |
kb9vqf | the only time I have been able to keep Compiz on is with an older Intel card on an IBM laptop |
KingSphinx | Seems Intel hardware is the most reliable when it comes to just about anything Linux-related... |
* KingSphinx has a Broadcom wireless chip that Ubuntu doesn't support out-of-box |
KingSphinx | That's actually not a good thing for me, since I kind of have to jump through hoops to get it running in *buntu, and sadly, if I wanted to install Trinity again (made a CD so I can revisit it), I don't think I could get my wireless working even with the instructions provided by the Ubuntu wiki because I'm not sure if Trinity provides the tools required. Bleh, that was a mouthful. |
KingSphinx | Specifically, these instructions: https://help.ubuntu.com/community/WifiDocs/Driver/bcm43xx |
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ar | KingSphinx: the only reliable thing about intel, where drivers do actually matter, are network cards |
ar | KingSphinx: i've seen enough rendering issues/artifacts on my laptop, which has intel graphics |
ar | Xu_R: "AA+"? i've heard something about "D" |
* kb9vqf thinks ar was looking trough a time vortex into a few years from now |
ar | no, not really: http://www.goldmadesimple.com/gold-made-simple-cuts-usa-rating-from-aaa-to-d |
ar | still, imo all of those "rating agencies" are just a scam |
ar | (and no, i don't live in the usa) |
KingSphinx | I really think the rating decrease seems kinda overdue... I mean, really? A nation that's untold trillions in debt and it has perfect credit? |
* kb9vqf agrees with KingSphinx |
KingSphinx | oh yeah! A question I've been meaning to ask: with the planned ports to RPM-based systems, will each distro retain its own artwork/theme or will it just be the "generic" KDE 3 look? |
kb9vqf | debt to GDP ratio is just too high |
kb9vqf | Xu_R might know |
kb9vqf | it depends on whether or not the distro maintainer(s) will pull in the original KDE3.5 theming from the distribution or not |
kb9vqf | I did with Ubuntu, but then again there have been several cycles since then, so the current artwork looks nothing like the original artwork ;-) |
kb9vqf | *release cycles |
KingSphinx | I think Fedora still has the Qt3 port of Bluecurve in its repos, and lol, I've noticed. |
KingSphinx | Hardy looked excellent, but it seems from 8.10 onward, Kubuntu just opted to use the "generic" themeing. |
kb9vqf | hmmm...8.10 sounds like the point at which my releases started |
kb9vqf | you must not have had the theming packages installed |
kb9vqf | for reference, here's how the Ubuntu releases look now: http://apt.pearsoncomputing.net/cdimages/ |
KingSphinx | Interesting... Enterprise Edition seems to vaguely resemble Windows XP (possibly on purpose?) |
KingSphinx | Desktop Edition seems to pretty much look like Hardy with a new wallpaper. Not a bad thing though, it looks great IMO. |
KingSphinx | Just what does Enterprise have that Desktop lacks? Additional apps/drivers? |
kb9vqf | yep |
kb9vqf | loads of apps |
kb9vqf | more drivers |
kb9vqf | and a cleaner, tighter widget style and theme |
kb9vqf | more along the lines of what you expect in a corporate environment |
ar | paypal :/ |
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Xu_R | ar: LOL |
Xu_R | kb9vqf: yes, distros will pull in KDE theming from the distribution D: |
Xu_R | and I dropped Fedora because they strictly forbid anything installed in /opt, which is a pain because then I have to conflict anything KDE4 |
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raevyn | Hello! So I havebeen playing with Trinity DVD today and realized its Ubuntu 10.10, just no GNOME desktop. Is that accurate? |
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KingSphinx | What's all this about Fedora forbidding anything installed in /opt? |
raevyn | hello. so i just compared my kde3 installation on ubuntu to the installation that is one the tde enterprise dvd.. and i am missing a huge number of files. |
raevyn | could this have been caused by installing kde4 first? |
KingSphinx | Well yeah, I'd believe the cause may actually just be that the Enterprise DVD has a lot of extra features, whereas installing via repo will just give the standard CD experience. |
raevyn | ohhhhh... <sighs> is there a way to remedy that? to get the entire KDE software set via repo? |
KingSphinx | Maube, but I'm not sure, I haven't had Trinity in a while. (it's not available for Fedora, nor does it seem likely in the forseeable future.) |
KingSphinx | *maybe |
raevyn | what if i moved the files i am missing from the virtual machine directory into the main system directory? |
raevyn | okay i copied kdf over and now it does run appearing with the kde3 theming rather than kde4.. so maybe that is all i have to do? |
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raevyn | hello im back. i had to restart. |
raevyn | so, i confirmed with another VM that indeed the enterprise version of TDE comes with more software. |
raevyn | But I have some concerns... Ubuntu was great at hardware detection and has a good software repo... so first off is the Trinity DVD incorporate thsoe ubuntu traits? And, I would like to still keep gnome or install it after installing Trinity Enterprise.. can I still do that? |
raevyn | oh you know, no on is here lol. I will try back on Monday |
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Xu_R | KingSphinx: uhhh... standard FHS, Fedora policy, etc? |
KingSphinx | Oh well, hopefully something can be done to get it ported to Fedora. If not, guess it's migration time for me. :/ |
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Raevyn | hi.. so somehow i have dolphin popping up on me when i open folders. is there a way to get back to konquerer? |
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Space_Man | K menu / System settings / Default applications / File associations / Inode / Directory / add Konqueror here or move it up |
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KingSphinx | Well, I was surprised to see that Trinity indeed has jockey-gtk, so I can still install the necessary drivers for my wireless card even with no wired connection. :D |
KingSphinx | Whoops, that didn't come out right. |
KingSphinx | I was surprised to see that Trinity still has jockey-gtk, so I can still install my wireless drivers. |
KingSphinx | Oh wait, that *did* all come out the first time. Sorry! ^^; |
* kb9vqf notes that we support GTK applications in preference to Qt4 ones, as 1) we can overlay Trinity themes on them and 2) they are more stable and less resource hungry than Qt4 apps tend to be |
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OnlyHuman | quack |
OnlyHuman | !rpm |
tbottu | OnlyHuman: Error: "rpm" is not a valid command. |
OnlyHuman | vrpm |
OnlyHuman | v rpm |
OnlyHuman | quack quack |
Xu_R | not cool, OnlyHuman |
OnlyHuman | oh |
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Xu_R | -_-"" |
Xu_R | I'll take the beating for him on this one. |
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l0ner | Hi |
elcaset__ | hello howdy |
l0ner | anyone here from who i could get some help with compiling (or rather non-compiling) parts of trinity? |
elcaset__ | I am not experienced enough to help with compiling, but I bet someone here ios. |
elcaset__ | oops, here is. |
l0ner | kb9vqf should be able to help |
l0ner | but it seems he's away |
elcaset__ | i tried Porteus GNU/Linux with Trinity pre-installed. i like it, so far. |
l0ner | I used the Ubuntu-based trinity distro |
l0ner | but it was ubuntu, which is too blated for me |
l0ner | normally I use gentoo |
l0ner | which I can configure any way I want |
KingSphinx | The only other version of Trinity available that I know of is Slackware, so... there's a Gentoo version? |
l0ner | no, there is overlay but it sucks |
KingSphinx | the kde-sunset overlay? |
l0ner | so I pulled trinity code from svn and I'm trying to compile it maually |
l0ner | no the kde-trinity |
KingSphinx | Wouldn't know about compiling something as big as Trinity, sorry. |
l0ner | it's not in the main overlay list |
l0ner | kay, I'll wait |
* KingSphinx has never used a Linux distro more complex than Fedora... |
l0ner | well, the gentoo is not complex |
l0ner | but You'll need to learn how it handles some aspects |
KingSphinx | I'm perfectly aware of DIY stuff like that, I just prefer the "noobier" stuff like Ubuntu/Fedora/Debian |
l0ner | I prefered it years ago |
l0ner | then I noticed it was too heavy for me, and too bloated |
l0ner | so I moved directly from ubuntu tu gentoo |
KingSphinx | Ah |
KingSphinx | Nice |
l0ner | and didn't had many problems |
KingSphinx | Nothing wrong with that, though I still prefer my choices. :P |
l0ner | the handbook is pretty clear on how to install it |
KingSphinx | USE flags seem very cool though. |
l0ner | yeah, I know ;) It's the "different distro for every user" rule :P |
l0ner | I even thought about doing it hardcore way, using the LFS |
l0ner | but it's a little too much for me :P |
KingSphinx | I might have to migrate back to Kubuntu Trinity, since it now seems unlikely that Trinity can be properly ported to Fedora (something about packages not being allowed to be installed in /opt...?) |
l0ner | dunno, never used Fedora. But I had read about it in the channels history |
l0ner | it seems pretty pointless blocking the /opt dir, which existence was to allow user install external thing he needed |
l0ner | at least it's what i had been told years ago |
KingSphinx | I know, but there's not much I can really do. But... I found my old Google Chrome install in /opt, and it was an RPM package, so maybe... hmm... |
l0ner | maybe they don't allow thing installed by user, |
l0ner | not by the repo system or things like that |
l0ner | or maybe it was there before they introduced this "nothing in /opt" rule and there is nothing that would delete it |
* l0ner thinks about getting some sleep |
l0ner | well... bbl |
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Space_Man | KDE Frameworks 5.0 In Development http://tech.slashdot.org/story/11/08/07/2128222/KDE-Frameworks-50-In-Development |
KingSphinx | It's only in development, but... this technically means Trinity's now two generations out-of-date. Dunno whether to laugh of feel depressed... |
KingSphinx | *or |
elcaset__ | some folks over at the PCLOS irc are trying to convince me that KDE Trinity has no hope. There is some hope, right? |
Space_Man | yes there is still lots of life in Trinity |
elcaset__ | awesome!. thanks Space_Man. |
Space_Man | has Qt5 even been announced? |
elcaset__ | it's in the works, but i don't know beyond that. |
Space_Man | a blogpost about qt5 http://labs.qt.nokia.com/2011/05/09/thoughts-about-qt-5/ |
elcaset__ | there were qt5 discussions supposedly at that KDE gathering in Europe that occured in the last 3 months. |
Space_Man | "beta quality code available towards the end of the year and final Qt 5.0 release some time during 2012." |
Space_Man | Tim has written "TQt" which bridges qt3 and qt4 |
KingSphinx | A question about TQt: is it supposed to be a fork of the old Qt3 or is it something like a bridge for Qt4? |
Space_Man | it used the best bits from both :P |
KingSphinx | Oh, nvm, saw above |
Space_Man | I'm 100% certain of the details |
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KingSphinx | Will there eventually be bits from Qt5? |
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Xu_R | KingSphinx: yes, there will. but we have to get to Qt4 first :P |
Xu_R | time to download the latest nightly build for my xubuntu and see the SVN changes :D |
* KingSphinx feels lost amongst all the programmers... (cannot program anything to save my life) |
Xu_R | well, I only know basic C++ programming |
Xu_R | that I learned last year... >_>" |
KingSphinx | I barely know HTML... ^^; |
Xu_R | I'm learning Java next year. Wish me luck, because Java is hell xD |
Xu_R | fk, I just remember I still have to renew my Linux Foundation Membership (which I didn't know I had >_>") |
Xu_R | *remembered |
Xu_R | ok, that's not good. latest nightly build isn't starting up trinity at all... |
Xu_R | but checking xsession-errors, it looks like everything is working... |
Xu_R | oh, god, I want to punch Upstart in the face so badly right now... |
* KingSphinx notes that this is why I'm not brave enough to use nightly builds |
* Xu_R is the daredevil on virtual machines :P |
Xu_R | KingSphinx: this is why I have XFCE as another desktop :P |
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kb9vqf | Xu_R: Nightly builds were suspended a few days ago due to old packages not being purge from the archive |
kb9vqf | The problem has been resolved and builds are restarting |
* kb9vqf whispers ethereal wisps of a new feature, long absent from Linux http://websvn.kde.org/?view=revision&revision=1245566 |
kb9vqf | For those who think Trinity has no future, bear in mind that we maintain Qt3 as upstream |
kb9vqf | Since Qt3 was absorbed, you could think of Trinity as a pure Xlib desktop ;-) |
kb9vqf | also, since TQt porting is complete, it would be theoretically possible to move Qt3 to the new TQ* namespace, thus eliminating any potential conflicts with Qt4 |
kb9vqf | this could be done independently of the Trinity desktop project |
kb9vqf | Qt4 is a shifting target (still!) and has significant performance issues |
kb9vqf | not all the problems with KDE4 are due to the KDE4 developers.... |
KingSphinx | I really don't get why there's people that say "Trinity has no future"; last I checked, as long as a project has demand and developers still active, it has a future. </opinion> |
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kde3ftw | anyone have any experience with servicemenus? I'm trying to make a right click open with console here for folders but when I use it, it always sends me to the ~ directory not the directory i right clicked on. My servicemenu .desktop file is here: http://pastebin.com/Z75CeD2f |
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kb9vqf | kde3ftw: You will need to pass the --workdir flag to Konsole, along with (so 'konsole --workdir ') |
kb9vqf | kde3ftw: You will need to pass the --workdir flag to Konsole, along with (so 'konsole --workdir %U') |
kb9vqf | grr |
kb9vqf | IRC keeps eating the % signs |
kb9vqf | let's try that one more time |
kb9vqf | kde3ftw: You will need to pass the --workdir flag to Konsole, along with %U (so 'konsole --workdir %U') |
kb9vqf | there we go |
kde3ftw | kb9vqf -- Thanks ill give it a try -- and btw thanks for all the development on kde3 :) |
kb9vqf | np |
kde3ftw | kb9vqf ---> the Exec='konsole --workdir %U" didnt work BUT Exec=konsole --workdir '%U' does! Thanks for pointing me in the right direction :) |
kb9vqf | glad to hear it |
kb9vqf | :) |
kb9vqf | yes, I forgot the quotes |
kb9vqf | it's been a while since I worked on service menus :) |
kde3ftw | whoops posted um wrong too.. did the " 's and ''s |
kde3ftw | hehhe |
kde3ftw | yeah.. having access to the console from anywhere is just so helpful though :) |
kde3ftw | kb9vqf -- thanks again and gnite! |
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KingSphinx | About the whole "Trinity-decoupling-from-Ubuntu" thing: the Kubuntu wiki says that Trinity's moved to a yearly schedule. Does this mean that the next release will likely be released as 11.10 or is this more of a "when it's done" sort of thing? |
kb9vqf | when it's done |
kb9vqf | probably on a yearly schedule |
kb9vqf | 6mos is too short |
KingSphinx | I imagine so, especially given the relative size of the project compared to, say, current KDE |
KingSphinx | With the instructions given on the site, however, it is possible to stay current? |
KingSphinx | Also, completely unrelated, but it really is impressive how lightweight 3.x is... just saw a video of someone running 3.5.10 very well on a Pentium 4 and only 1 GB of RAM :) |
kb9vqf | we are building Natty packages now |
kb9vqf | there won't be this long hiatus in the future |
kb9vqf | our build system broke when Natty was released |
kb9vqf | due to Autotools changes |
kb9vqf | it took quite some time to get those problems fixed |
kb9vqf | IMHO the desktop *should* be that light :) |
kb9vqf | believe it or not, on powerful, modern hardware, Trinity still feels a bit sluggish at times when used at very high screen resolutions |
KingSphinx | Just for curiosity's sake (sorry, I love asking questions), it'll pretty much by Natty, but still 3.5.12? |
KingSphinx | 1280x1024's not that high, is it? |
kb9vqf | no |
kb9vqf | try 1080 ;-) |
kb9vqf | try 3840x1080 ;-) |
kb9vqf | what do you mean "by natty"? |
KingSphinx | Wow |
* kb9vqf thinks KDE4 would be especially unusable at that resolution |
KingSphinx | lol, possibly |
KingSphinx | You'd need one heck of a computer to run it at a decent speed, that's for sure |
* KingSphinx still ran KDE 4.2 on a 2.4 GHz Pentium 4 and 512 MB of RAM back when 9.04 was around |
KingSphinx | I still have that old clunker of a computer, just upgraded to 1 GB RAM and GeForce 4 graphics |
elcaset__ | KDE 4.2 is a lot faster than KDE 4.5 in my usage. |
KingSphinx | Somehow, KDE 4 ran just as badly after the upgrades. |
KingSphinx | You know a desktop is bloated when Trinity can beat it running off the CD |
KingSphinx | To be fair, 4 runs pretty well on my current rig, but Trinity's still ending up on it one way or another. Even if I have to distro-hop back to Kubuntu to do it. |
* KingSphinx is wondering how exactly one goes about installing a new distro over an old one while keeping your /home partition |
kb9vqf | a cell phone OS may run very well on a desktop computer, but then why have the desktop computer at all? Just buy another cell phone... :-P |
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* l0ner is back |
l0ner | Notice: the trinitydesktop.org/wiki main page has been spammed and now it's displaying some text about insurances... |
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Space_Man | the wiki spam has been removed |
l0ner | good thing |
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l0ner | I'm having trouble compiling the kdelibs. Error I get: http://paste.pocoo.org/raw/454660/ |
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MutantTurkey | I had this idea. |
MutantTurkey | basically I am sick of programs stealing CPU uselessly, and i was thinking (if only i could pause them!) but then i thought, wait this is linux. SIGTSTP works perfectly. |
MutantTurkey | Now I am hacking onto dwm to automatically SIGTSTP anytime a window goes out of focus. |
MutantTurkey | then SIGTCONT when it is refocused |
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*** Xu_R is now known as Xu_R|ZNC |
*** Xu_R|ZNC is now known as Xu_R |
MutantTurkey | o/ Xu_R |
Xu_R | hey MutantTurkey |
MutantTurkey | whats up man |
Xu_R | gotta finish summer hw and get stuff |
MutantTurkey | oh nice |
ar | MutantTurkey: you know you're basically reimplementing ios multitasking? |
MutantTurkey | title |
MutantTurkey | ar: what! |
MutantTurkey | ar: no idea actually, what is ios? |
Xu_R | MutantTurkey: iOS = iPhone OS |
MutantTurkey | oh |
MutantTurkey | so yes basically. |
MutantTurkey | except on the desktop |
ar | yes |
ar | and it might be a good battery saver |
MutantTurkey | because I don't need ffx taking 25% cpu to draw gifs and flash apps in the background |
MutantTurkey | indeed |
MutantTurkey | I need a system of orginizing and tagging programs. |
MutantTurkey | so that all firefox's pause automatically, but never do it to a terminal etc. |
MutantTurkey | and manual for all of it |
l0ner | MutantTurkey: share it when You finish it |
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kb9vqf | Space_Man: Where was the wiki spam, and do you know how it got there? |
kb9vqf | It sounds like something wasn't locked down correctly |
Space_Man | 2 people made accounts, #1 added a new page and the #2 added a new page and edited the start page |
Space_Man | http://trinitydesktop.org/wiki/bin/view/Main/WebStatistics |
Space_Man | the pages were ShortTermLoans and Trash.MainJazelAseAs |
Space_Man | the spammers were RaynnPada and MainJazelAseAs |
Space_Man | earlier I made a foswiki account and deleted the pages and users |
MutantTurkey | |
l0ner | kb9vqf: I have some problems compiling the kdelibs. Don't know if you've seen my msg earlier |
kb9vqf | no I didn't |
kb9vqf | what is your problem? |
l0ner | http://paste.pocoo.org/raw/454660/ |
l0ner | this is what i get |
kb9vqf | compile and install the latest Qt3 sources from our GIT repository |
kb9vqf | our Qt3 is extended vs. the old Qt3 in most distributions' package systems |
l0ner | did, but I will try to recompile |
kb9vqf | yes, the change is recent |
kb9vqf | within the past few days |
l0ner | ok, is there any way to checkout anonymously from your git? |
kb9vqf | yes |
MutantTurkey | same way as regularly |
MutantTurkey | just don't use the user@ bit |
l0ner | ok, thx |
MutantTurkey | kb9vqf: the development page is handy |
kb9vqf | glad to hear it :) |
kb9vqf | (of course you were the one that worked on it so...) |
MutantTurkey | it should encourage more developers anyhow |
kb9vqf | Space_Man: The main Web was not locked down |
kb9vqf | It is now |
kb9vqf | no more spam I hope :) |
l0ner | linux amuses me... |
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Raevyn | Hello. Is there any instructions to install TDE on ubuntu 11? |
Raevyn | oh.. well thats odd. I uninstalled kde 4 and that took out much of tde.. though the software center seems to be running something to repair broken deps |
Space_Man | Raevyn: did you fix your Dolphin / Konqueror problem? |
Raevyn | oh yes.. i uninstalled dolphin |
Space_Man | good |
Raevyn | it owuld be nice to have it as an option but I couldnt find anyplace to go to make konqeror my default |
Space_Man | K menu / System settings / Default applications / File associations / Inode / Directory / add Konqueror here or move it up |
Raevyn | thank you! I will try it again :) |
Space_Man | did you use ubuntu or kubuntu 11.04? |
Raevyn | ubuntu 10.10 upgraded to 11.04. |
Space_Man | later I'm going to install ubuntu 11.04 trinity but I don't know how to |
Space_Man | I guess install ubuntu 11.04 then add the trinity repo's |
Raevyn | I was going to let the software center fix itself then try installing TDE again |
Raevyn | hm.. it still fails to install. is there maybe a way to make it install if it was installed previously and was damaged? |
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kb9vqf | Xu_R: I think the polkit problem is fixed with the new package tde-ubuntu-integration |
kb9vqf | can you try it? |
*** kb9vqf changes topic to "Trinity Desktop Environment 3.5.12 is out! Get it at http://www.trinitydesktop.org Also, consider joining the Trinity mailing lists [http://bit.ly/hZ83mF]. IRC will be most active/helpful during business hours in the USA. BOTW #394 [http://bit.ly/i3tpT5] CMake status [http://bit.ly/fvh4f2] Natty [http://bit.ly/kzH5mO] Support the Project! [http://bit.ly/pmkMVB]" |
l0ner | can I ask someting? |
l0ner | what exactly aRts is? |
kb9vqf | it's a sound system proxy |
kb9vqf | a sort of abstraction layer that sits between Trinity apps and OSS/ALSA/PulseAudio/etc |
l0ner | ok, thx |
l0ner | another question: do You plan on supporting PulseAudio, with it's fetures, in TDE? |
l0ner | since PulseAudio seems like nice thing when looked at description on their main page |
l0ner | yet, I never seen it actually work like it should |
Xu_R | kb9vqf: back from school supply shopping XD yess, will boot up and test asap |
kb9vqf | l0ner: Which features? |
kb9vqf | Pulse works fine in Trinity right now |
l0ner | kb9vqf: like separate volume control for each app |
l0ner | or it is already included |
kb9vqf | for each app? no |
kb9vqf | didn't even know that was available :-/ |
l0ner | "Generic hardware abstraction, giving the possibility of doing things like individual volumes per application." |
l0ner | taken from pulse website |
l0ner | it would be really nice to have this, since I was using this a lot in win7 |
l0ner | and I always missed this in linux |
kb9vqf | I don't even know if any GUIs/DEs currently allow you to do that |
kb9vqf | Never heard of it personally |
kb9vqf | Just because a backedn supports something doesn't mean there are any frontends yet--just look at XRandR 1.2 |
kb9vqf | :) |
kb9vqf | *backend |
Xu_R | kb9vqf: the package hasn't appeared on mirrors yet, so you'll have to wait a day D: |
kb9vqf | That being said...you should file a feature request bug report |
kb9vqf | Xu_R: OK |
kb9vqf | that makes sense |
Xu_R | kb9vqf: how about kdesudo? is it fixed? :o |
l0ner | kb9vqf: will thought about it ;) |
kb9vqf | l0ner: Describe at least one way to access the proposed feature (e.g. via a configuration dialog in kmix, right-clicking on a running application titlebar/taskbar entry, etc.) |
kb9vqf | in the bug report that is |
kb9vqf | Xu_R: you can pull it directly from https://quickbuild.pearsoncomputing.net/~trinity/+archive/trinity-nightly-builds/+files/tde-ubuntu-integration_0.1-0_all.deb |
Xu_R | ok |
l0ner | kb9vqf: ok, I will do it later, when I thought about it ;) |
kb9vqf | sure :) |
kb9vqf | we can't know what our users want unless they tell us :) |
MutantTurkey | kb9vqf: what is the meta package for trinity under debian? |
MutantTurkey | as in, how can I install all trinity packages with a single command |
Xu_R | kb9vqf: testing |
Xu_R | and I confirmed a TDE entry now in KDM :D |
Xu_R | kb9vqf: and it works :D |
kb9vqf | MutantTurkey: kde-trinity |
MutantTurkey | thanks |
kb9vqf | Xu_R: Without your previous hack in place? |
Xu_R | yea |
kb9vqf | great! |
MutantTurkey | also what l0ner said is a great idea |
Xu_R | I removed the previous hack before installing the package |
kb9vqf | Xu_R: I set ksmserver to recommend tde-ubuntu-integration |
Xu_R | ok |
kb9vqf | so it should get sucked in when someone installs via the metapackage |
Xu_R | ok |
kb9vqf | and if it doesn't, a search in synaptic for tde and policykit should turn it up ;-) |
Xu_R | :) |
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Xu_R | kb9vqf: D: kdesu still doesn't work... |
kb9vqf | I expect that |
kb9vqf | it hasn't been uploaded yet |
Xu_R | ah, ok. |
kb9vqf | as I mentioned before the nightly builds stalled due to obsolete packages not being automatically purged |
Xu_R | ah, right. |
kb9vqf | it's amazing how fast you can chew through disk space that way :rolleyes: |
kb9vqf | I'm working on a few glitches, then I'll restart the builds |
Xu_R | oh, yea. I know. /me looks at his server here... >_> |
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MutantTurkey | installing trinity on my vps xD |
Xu_R | kb9vqf: ok, this is an interesting development |
Xu_R | kb9vqf: I got tired of kdesudo, so I removed kdesudo-trinity... |
Xu_R | and then all of a sudden it's working... without the package? |
Xu_R | ok, lemme rephrase that - kdesudo isn't working, but kdesu *is* and is accepting sudo requests... |
kb9vqf | right |
kb9vqf | kdesu is the fallback |
* Xu_R is glad now that he killed off the kdesudo-trinity package then because it's not working... |
MutantTurkey | wubwubwub |
MutantTurkey | I did apt-get install kde-trinity and everything is named like kde4... |
MutantTurkey | even while it works like trinity |
MutantTurkey | actually I have no idea whats going on |
l0ner | damn |
l0ner | I recompiled qt, recompiled tqt, and arts |
l0ner | and I still can't compile kdelibs |
l0ner | I the same error |
l0ner | *I got |
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MutantTurkey | weird |
MutantTurkey | kicker is eating my cpu at 100% |
MutantTurkey | is that normal for first boot? |
MutantTurkey | caching the entries or something? |
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MutantTurkey | kb9vqf: ^ |
MutantTurkey | weird |
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MutantTurkey | what i think happened was that kde4 started alongside trinity, and locked everything up. |
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KingSphinx | I got Trinity installed! :D |
Xu_R | :D |
KingSphinx | And managed to keep my /home as well, though getting wireless working with no wired connection was a PITA |
Xu_R | always is. |
KingSphinx | Especially with Broadcom cards... |
MutantTurkey | wireless is a totaly pain if you don't memorize how to do it. |
MutantTurkey | at this point I have it all memorized. |
MutantTurkey | dhcpcd is your friend!! |
l0ner | strange, i had no problem with my broadcom card |
MutantTurkey | l0ner: about half the people love it, the other half hate it. |
l0ner | yeah, i know |
l0ner | problem is, 99% of users are using generic kernel |
KingSphinx | Fedora didn't have any trouble detecting/using it out-of-box... and *only* Fedora can, I don't know why. |
l0ner | and need to use strange things |
MutantTurkey | KingSphinx: haven't tried arch yet then :p |
Xu_R | or suse :P |
MutantTurkey | doesn't everyone still mostly self compile kernels? |
l0ner | maybe because Fedora has precompiled modules for broadcom and ships firmware |
KingSphinx | Tried SuSE, that doesn't either |
l0ner | depends |
Xu_R | strange - I've always gotten SuSE to work for me... /me has strange luck with it |
l0ner | about what kind of user we are talking? unless you are advanced, you'll use generic kernel |
l0ner | even on gentoo, where compiling your own kernel is a part of installation, there are some people who prefer the genkernel |
MutantTurkey | I suqqsaI suppose |
MutantTurkey | I always have self compiled, out of habit I guess |
MutantTurkey | plus my kernel is lean and mean |
l0ner | I have self compiled because i like my kernel minimal and moduleless |
l0ner | i keep only minimal set of modules, everything else is included in kernel |
MutantTurkey | indeed |
MutantTurkey | modules are annoying as heck |
l0ner | and they slow down bootup |
MutantTurkey | my hardware is always the same, therefore dynamic loaded modules is ineffiecient |
l0ner | same for me, sice I'm running linux on my laptop |
MutantTurkey | exactly |
kb9vqf | l0ner: Then you must have two versions of Qt3 installed |
kb9vqf | ours and your distro's stock version |
kb9vqf | try to locate qstyle |
kb9vqf | try to 'locate qstyle.h' and see if you have it in multiple header directories |
l0ner | the problem is: my distro don't ship qt3 anymore |
KingSphinx | Your distro of choice? |
l0ner | they stopped something like 2 years ago, when decided to drop kde3.5 |
l0ner | gentoo |
KingSphinx | kde-sunset overlay? |
* Xu_R wonders where samelian went |
* Xu_R notes that samelian was working on gentoo/kde-sunset IIRC |
l0ner | i used it, but it sucked, too many bugs, so i purged my system from it |
l0ner | right now i should have only qt3 from your git |
* KingSphinx wonders if TDE will get ported to Gentoo... |
l0ner | i was thinking about it |
KingSphinx | Also, just my opinion, but while TDE's version of Konqueror makes a great file manager, it's kinda dated as a web browser. |
l0ner | KingSphinx: never liked konqueror as web browser |
l0ner | i prefer have them separated |
KingSphinx | Current version of Konqueror's much-improved, I can say this from experience. |
l0ner | but it's because of my philosophy: one app for one thing |
l0ner | KingSphinx: you say? maybe i'll try to give it a shot |
MutantTurkey | l0ner: i follow that mostly as well. |
KingSphinx | Quick question: would simply installing ubuntu-restricted-extras do the trick for MP3 codecs and Flash/whatever? |
KingSphinx | Or does Trinity have its own way of installing proprietary codecs? |
Xu_R | KingSphinx: ubuntu-restricted-extras is all you need |
MutantTurkey | guys I am running into a big problem |
MutantTurkey | first of all kde4 is running alongside trinity, no idea why. |
MutantTurkey | second of all, I have no idea how it got installed D: |
KingSphinx | That sounds odd, yet strangely cool. |
Xu_R | sounds like recommends got pulled in |
l0ner | ok, I think i found where my problem is |
MutantTurkey | Xu_R: yeah.. |
Xu_R | MutantTurkey: try removing any bits of kde4 you have |
Xu_R | (just remove qt4, it'll pull down the rest of kde4) |
MutantTurkey | apt-get remove? |
Xu_R | yea |
MutantTurkey | it says unable to locate qt4 |
Xu_R | MutantTurkey: apt-cache search qt4 | less |
Xu_R | and locate the qt4 libarary |
Xu_R | *library |
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MutantTurkey | anot even there. |
MutantTurkey | apt is so counter intuitive |
kb9vqf | MutantTurkey: That happens because Plasma is set to autolaunch at all times |
MutantTurkey | kb9vqf: what should I do? |
kb9vqf | Really stupid design decision IMHO |
kb9vqf | which version of Ubuntu are you on? |
MutantTurkey | debian |
kb9vqf | oh |
kb9vqf | look for the plasma.desktop autostart file |
kb9vqf | and for now move it somewhere else |
MutantTurkey | where whould that be? |
kb9vqf | that will kill KDE4 though |
kb9vqf | try in /etc/xdg/autostart or similar |
kb9vqf | I don't recall OTOH |
MutantTurkey | not there. |
* Xu_R is pretty sure MutantTurkey doesn't want kde4 anyway XP |
MutantTurkey | I don't even have kde4 installed afaik |
kb9vqf | well then move /usr/bin/plasma to /usr/bin/plasma.bkp ;-) |
kb9vqf | that will completely kill KDE4 :) |
Xu_R | or remove libqtcore4 |
Xu_R | (and kill everything >:D) |
MutantTurkey | ok |
MutantTurkey | goot call |
kb9vqf | the /usr/bin/plasma hack will at least let you use KDE4 apps if neede |
kb9vqf | *needed |
MutantTurkey | I don't even use kde4.... |
MutantTurkey | I don't even know how it got here! |
Xu_R | use aptitude next time ;P |
kb9vqf | probably through some weird apt recommends chain |
MutantTurkey | darn |
MutantTurkey | frankly I don't understand the whole dkpksystem |
MutantTurkey | and there is terrible lag all of a sudden :[ |
l0ner | thats why i choose gentoo |
l0ner | i control what i get in my system |
l0ner | and i can configure some dependencies through USE flags |
kb9vqf | to each his own |
Xu_R | hehe. |
kb9vqf | in my case gentoo would represent unmanageable administrative overhead :) |
kb9vqf | so it was worth it to learn dpkg in all its gory detauls |
kb9vqf | *details |
MutantTurkey | l0ner: thats why I use arch,... because it doesn't suck with dpepends |
l0ner | MutantTurkey: from what i heard from my friend who uses arch, they are pretty much the same |
l0ner | gentoo and arch i mean |
MutantTurkey | similar |
MutantTurkey | . |
MutantTurkey | but not identical |
MutantTurkey | I think pacman is very sane for package managing. |
l0ner | maybe some day i will try arch |
MutantTurkey | alot of people make the switch from gentoo |
l0ner | i imagine |
l0ner | since first 4 attempts to install will fail :P |
MutantTurkey | hahaha |
l0ner | it was like this for me |
l0ner | but back then gcc didn't accept CFLAGS="-march=native" |
l0ner | one i set this wrong, second time i tried to install gentoo without multilib on 64bit system |
l0ner | back then it was impossible to get working system without multilib |
l0ner | third time i dont remember, but i think i had some issues with ld |
l0ner | fourth finally was successful ;) |
MutantTurkey | that is the greatest thing ever |
MutantTurkey | -march=native is awesome. |
l0ner | yeah :) |
l0ner | it resolved problems with choosing right march |
MutantTurkey | exactly |
l0ner | on some strange processors like mine i3 |
MutantTurkey | atom really benifits |
MutantTurkey | because its stack is different |
l0ner | I can imagine ;) |
* l0ner never had atom based machine though |
MutantTurkey | I love it |
MutantTurkey | i mean it pulls like 25W of power |
MutantTurkey | at max load... |
l0ner | whoah |
MutantTurkey | yeah. |
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kb9vqf | of course it's not much more powerful than a pocket calculator ;-) |
Xu_R | XD |
MutantTurkey | basically not :P |
Xu_R | looks like l0ner abruptly exited... |
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Xu_R | wb l0ner |
l0ner | i accidentally hit ctrl+w |
MutantTurkey | actually It ranks somewghere really low on the scale |
Xu_R | oops lol |
l0ner | which closes current tab in kvirc |
l0ner | MutantTurkey: my laptop pulls something around 50W on battery |
MutantTurkey | yeah |
l0ner | and 25W on ac plugged on |
l0ner | and i cannot understand why |
kb9vqf | graphics card |
kb9vqf | Linux probably does not put it to sleep as it should |
l0ner | maybe |
kb9vqf | which graphics card manufacturer |
kb9vqf | ? |
l0ner | ati |
MutantTurkey | also I love the atom because it has great support for linux |
kb9vqf | yup |
MutantTurkey | everything runs great. |
kb9vqf | stinko |
Xu_R | :P |
MutantTurkey | only think I dislike is the lack of any processing power... |
MutantTurkey | also the graphics card is weak |
MutantTurkey | but the newer versions have improved considerably. |
kb9vqf | that's how you get low power ;P |
l0ner | I was monitoring everything with powertop and noticed that acpi is waking up the processor more on battery |
l0ner | while on ac it isn't |
kb9vqf | newer kernels should fix that |
l0ner | i'm using 2.6.39 |
l0ner | right now |
kb9vqf | oh |
kb9vqf | then I have no idea :) |
MutantTurkey | not 3.0? |
MutantTurkey | I mean we have 3.0 in our regular core now... |
l0ner | gentoo don't have it yet in stable |
kb9vqf | oh wait |
kb9vqf | http://www.tech-info.com.ar/second-major-power-regression-found-in-linux-kernel-ubuntu/ |
l0ner | it's masked right now |
kb9vqf | 2.6.39 is the problem |
MutantTurkey | arch is like bleeed bleed bleeding edge. |
l0ner | lol |
MutantTurkey | I run arch + testing branch. |
MutantTurkey | but somehow Ihave never had a problem! |
l0ner | ok, i'll update my kernel when 3.0 hits stable |
l0ner | i thought it was because my laptop was samsung |
MutantTurkey | samsung? |
MutantTurkey | thats the problem |
MutantTurkey | next time buy a better laptop xD |
l0ner | and use some obscure thigns for power mngmnt |
kb9vqf | odd hardware may not have full support from Linux |
l0ner | i know |
MutantTurkey | actually I have a few samsung products I really love |
kb9vqf | also ACPI is sometimes handled by the BIOS |
l0ner | but i didn't had much choice |
l0ner | it was a present from my grandfather |
kb9vqf | so the wakeup events may just increase due to the design of the laptop |
MutantTurkey | ah |
MutantTurkey | I have a problem with ext4 |
kb9vqf | e.g. the BIOS may be monitoring the battery more frequently, etc. |
MutantTurkey | it won't let me hard drive sleep ever |
MutantTurkey | it constantly writes back to me |
l0ner | the only samsung devices i love are their tv |
MutantTurkey | dumb journaling |
kb9vqf | MutantTurkey: Increase the commit interval and use noatime |
l0ner | anyway i'll look at my power issues after i managed to install trinity ;D |
kb9vqf | noatime should do it alone in theory :)( |
MutantTurkey | kb9vqf: I do... |
MutantTurkey | and noatime is default |
MutantTurkey | its the journaling writeback. |
kb9vqf | no it isn't default |
MutantTurkey | and even with a 1 minute commit, it's pointless |
kb9vqf | I know from experience |
MutantTurkey | kb9vqf: I mean for my systems :) |
kb9vqf | oh, OK :) |
MutantTurkey | I need to disable commits while not doing anything, |
kb9vqf | no, you need to disable writing to disk when not doing anything |
MutantTurkey | nothing writes to it though |
MutantTurkey | it's jus the journal every 15 seconds or so |
kb9vqf | you have a nasty little app somewhere that like to write to the disk |
kb9vqf | hmm |
MutantTurkey | nope |
MutantTurkey | I don't even run logs. |
kb9vqf | that doesn't sound right |
kb9vqf | the journal would only be updated if something is written to disk |
MutantTurkey | I did a bit of research and It seems a few people has this problem |
kb9vqf | ok |
kb9vqf | sounds weird |
kb9vqf | on my systems ext4 is great |
l0ner | kb9vgf: ok, so i found where my problem was, recompiled everyting and now i get this: http://paste.pocoo.org/show/454951/ |
kb9vqf | ooh, nice |
kb9vqf | what architecture are you on? |
l0ner | x86_64 |
MutantTurkey | https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/linux/+bug/607560 |
MutantTurkey | that bug report just goes on and on |
kb9vqf | l0ner: Sounds like HAVE_SYS_STAT_H is unset |
kb9vqf | are you compiling with CMake? |
l0ner | yes |
l0ner | i followed the wiki |
kb9vqf | l0ner: Do you have sys/stat.h present on your system? |
l0ner | kb9vqf: dunno, will look it up now. But i think not |
kb9vqf | ok, that's your problem |
kb9vqf | install whatever package provides it |
kb9vqf | and rerun the entire compilation of kdelibs |
l0ner | kb9vqf: ok, thx ;) |
l0ner | will report how it has gone |
l0ner | kb9vqf: wait, i think i found it in /usr/include/sys/stat.h |
MutantTurkey | anyway, I've gotta catch the train i'll see you folks later! |
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* KingSphinx is wondering why GTK apps aren't blending in... |
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KingSphinx | I have gtk-qt-engine installed, but they aren't blending in. |
KingSphinx | Do I need to tell GTK to use Qt styles in System Settings? |
kb9vqf | KingSphinx: "Use my KDE style" |
kb9vqf | then logout/login |
kb9vqf | also, Firefox is a royal pain |
kb9vqf | it likes to use its own widgets for several items |
kb9vqf | Firefox 4 is worse in this respect |
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KingSphinx | There we go, that fixed it. |
kb9vqf | what did? |
kb9vqf | oh, nevermind |
kb9vqf | sorry |
kb9vqf | l0ner_away: CMake can't find your sys/stat.h file |
kb9vqf | you will need to look in its logs to figure out why |
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l0ner_away | kb9vqf: ok, will look it up now |
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l0ner | kb9vqf: "-- Looking for sys/stat.h - found" taken from cmake output |
kb9vqf | hmm |
kb9vqf | l0ner: OK, in kdelibs/dcop/dcopserver.cpp, comment out the HAVE_SYS_STAT_H #ifdef and #endif |
kb9vqf | then try recomliling |
kb9vqf | *recompiling |
l0ner | kb9vqf: as for now it's compiling |
l0ner | uh... error: http://paste.pocoo.org/show/454963/ |
l0ner | here is the cmake optput: http://paste.pocoo.org/show/454964/ |
kb9vqf | hmm |
kb9vqf | obviously the header autodetection system is not working on your system |
kb9vqf | l0ner: Ask on the mailing list with your logs |
kb9vqf | I didn't write the CMake code for that function, and from what I can tell it should be working |
kb9vqf | the only thing I can suggest is to look in the generated config.h file and make sure HAVE_SYS_STAT_H is set |
l0ner | ok |
kb9vqf | sorry I can't be of much more help here |
l0ner | kb9vqf: no prob ;0 |
l0ner | * :) |
l0ner | anyway, it seems that HAVE_SYS_STAT_H is set, i found it in the config.h file |
l0ner | i will ask on dev mailing list |
l0ner | kb9vqf: it will be better to send message to the developers list, or the users one? |
kb9vqf | developers |
kb9vqf | it may take some time too |
l0ner | ok, thx. Sending now |
kb9vqf | Serghei Amelian will know the most about CMake |
l0ner | uh... my message wasn't delivered |
kb9vqf | l0ner: Are you a list member? |
l0ner | I subscribed before sending |
kb9vqf | and did you get the confirmation message? |
kb9vqf | for subscription that is |
l0ner | yes |
kb9vqf | where did you send you message to? |
l0ner | trinity-devel@lists.pearsoncomputing.net |
l0ner | but it tells me that only subscribers can send messages to the list |
kb9vqf | which list did you subscribe to? |
kb9vqf | you need to subscribe to trinity-devel |
kb9vqf | not trinity-users |
l0ner | and i subscribed by sending a empty mail to trinity-devel-subscribe@lists.pearsoncomputing.net |
kb9vqf | what is your Email address? |
l0ner | sh4dou@gmail.com |
kb9vqf | l0ner: I manually added you |
kb9vqf | you weren't subscribed |
l0ner | ok, thx ;) |
kb9vqf | np |
l0ner | strange, since I recieved the confirmation mail |
kb9vqf | I know |
kb9vqf | sometimes weird things happen |
kb9vqf | l0ner: you did respond to the confirmation email, right |
kb9vqf | ? |
l0ner | yep |
kb9vqf | huh |
kb9vqf | oh well |
kb9vqf | :) |
l0ner | but now i got message from gmail that my message couldn't be sent |
l0ner | maybe gmail webmail issues |
kb9vqf | sounds like it |
kb9vqf | that's why I don't question the failures |
kb9vqf | it can fail at so many points |
kb9vqf | and do so intermittently |
l0ner | yes |
kb9vqf | all I know is that my servers work :) |
kb9vqf | it's up to everyone else's Email to work properly |
l0ner | and the more complex the system is, the more it can broke |
kb9vqf | yep |
kb9vqf | Google does glitch from time to time |
l0ner | normally i'd use some app for my mail, but right now i have clean gentoo, only with gnome, and I can't setup the evolution to work properely |
* l0ner is thinking about getting some sleep |
l0ner | well, I'll be back when when my actuall problem get resolved and I stumble over another ;P |
l0ner | cy |
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KingSphinx | Yay, Audacity seems to want to crash under Trinity... |
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MutantTurkey | trying to do this all in a chroot :) |
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KingSphinx | Is there any way to get Konqueror to use something besides KHTML or is that beyond the capabilities of this version of Konqueror? |
kb9vqf | KHTMl is your only option |
kb9vqf | I know the new one uses Webkit, but the new one is missing so many feature that it is unusable IMHO |
kb9vqf | kind of like comparing Trinity's Konqueror to the mac file browser |
kb9vqf | besides, Chrome is faster ;-) |
KingSphinx | Eh, kinda expected that. The current Konqueror IMO wasn't too bad as a web browser (KHTML's made a ton of steps forward), but it's sort of forgotten how to be a good file manager. Sort of the opposite of this version. :P |
kb9vqf | yep |
kb9vqf | so, use two separate apps |
kb9vqf | let each be best for one thing for now :) |
KingSphinx | Firefox does the job... plus it can actually save stuff. Chromium at the moment doesn't seem to want to let me save anything; it'll open up Nautilus' save dialog and whatnot, but it's not really saving anything because the download bar's not showing up. |
KingSphinx | Not to mention Audacity seems to crash with kgtk-qt3 providing the open/save dialogs. |
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MutantTurkey | kb9vqf: well I can test bugs now! |
MutantTurkey | using rdesktop to my vps |
kb9vqf | great! :) |
kb9vqf | KingSphinx: I think that crash is fixed in SVN |
MutantTurkey | so I will be hacking out bugs asap |
kb9vqf | KingSphinx: if you are using 3.5.12 then I would expect the crash to exist |
kb9vqf | MutantTurkey: OK |
kb9vqf | sounds very good |
MutantTurkey | just trying to strip it down to help it run faster |
MutantTurkey | over the network |
MutantTurkey | so disabling stuff right now |
MutantTurkey | looking back, the motif theme was just patheticly awful |
MutantTurkey | frankly solaris and CDE all looked like crap... I mean it wasn't even simple it was just bad. |
MutantTurkey | the themes were horrid |
KingSphinx | I find a charm in the eye-gouging ugliness of it all. |
MutantTurkey | KingSphinx: I prefer simple themes, yet i still am unhappy with every one i find |
MutantTurkey | actually this one I am using now is great |
KingSphinx | Isn't Trinity's default theme the same one used in Kubuntu Hardy? |
KingSphinx | Just with a new wallpaper? |
kb9vqf | yeo |
kb9vqf | *yep |
kb9vqf | BTW Trinity contains several simple themes |
KingSphinx | Yeah, I know, I've gone through them :) |
kb9vqf | do you like Windows 2000? |
kb9vqf | thw widget theme that is |
kb9vqf | *the |
* kb9vqf can't type...again |
MutantTurkey | light style 2 is my new fav |
KingSphinx | I do like the style of Windows Classic (pretty much 95-2000), but not on my Linux partition. :P |
MutantTurkey | I can't stand the new windows themes |
MutantTurkey | the old ones I like due to simplicity |
KingSphinx | It just doesn't look "right" having TDE look like old Windows... |
kb9vqf | ah |
kb9vqf | just curious |
kb9vqf | personally I use Lipstik |
kb9vqf | it's relatively light and gives lots of information when widgets are hovered upon, etc. |
MutantTurkey | is bug 229 still valid? It seems this is already included.. |
tbottu | 04Bug http://bugs.pearsoncomputing.net/show_bug.cgi?id=229 normal, P5, ---, kb9vqf, REOPENED, include kickoff menu with trinity |
kb9vqf | reopened? |
kb9vqf | why? |
kb9vqf | It's definitely there :) |
MutantTurkey | yeah.. |
MutantTurkey | well robert left some message at the bottom |
kb9vqf | oh |
kb9vqf | great |
kb9vqf | I don't support Kickoff |
MutantTurkey | :P |
kb9vqf | if he wants to fix it then he can be my guest :) |
MutantTurkey | since it stinks... |
MutantTurkey | its really counter intuitive and requires alot more thought. |
kb9vqf | yes |
kb9vqf | I hate it |
kb9vqf | split the bug |
MutantTurkey | mark as WONTFIX? |
kb9vqf | create a new one for the Kickoff improvements, copy&paste his text, then mark this one closed |
MutantTurkey | let me check them first |
MutantTurkey | maybe an old probelm |
KingSphinx | That said though (about the Redmond theme), it does do a good job replicating the Windows look. |
kb9vqf | asteriod is much closer |
MutantTurkey | redmond does a good job |
kb9vqf | *asteroid |
KingSphinx | I think KDE 4.8 might replace Kickoff with something else... |
MutantTurkey | I can't get past nepomuk |
MutantTurkey | it just kills me. |
kb9vqf | MutantTurkey: also make sure the new bug is marked lowest priority |
kb9vqf | nepomuk STINKS |
kb9vqf | there are parts of Windows I like |
MutantTurkey | well most of his stuff works for me... |
kb9vqf | but only up to Windows XP and the old interface |
kb9vqf | (not the new "Crayola" one) |
MutantTurkey | also, whats the state of our khtml? |
kb9vqf | MutantTurkey: Say so in the new bug report |
kb9vqf | MutantTurkey: Just as bad as ever |
kb9vqf | it's a very low priority here |
MutantTurkey | yes I assumed so |
MutantTurkey | we are going to do a -> webkit right? |
kb9vqf | as we have a handful of good web browsers available |
KingSphinx | And I'm guessing unlikely to get any better? |
MutantTurkey | tqt interface to webkit. :P |
kb9vqf | firefox, chrome, opera, etc. |
kb9vqf | eventually a KHTML->Webkit transition is planned, but I haven't even started |
MutantTurkey | I love webkit (i have my own gtk webkit browser) |
kb9vqf | volunteers are welcome :) |
kb9vqf | actually as soon as we get completely off the Qt namespace we can integrate Webkit |
kb9vqf | as the code is TQt ported we are very close |
kb9vqf | to getting off the Qt namespace that is :)_ |
MutantTurkey | kb9vqf: looks like his remarks are invalid. |
MutantTurkey | none seem to apply for me |
kb9vqf | ok...but that still doesn't make the fact that he posted to a substantially different bug any better :-P |
MutantTurkey | I am going to close it. |
kb9vqf | mark it closed, mention that it works for you, and remind him that a new bug report should be filed |
MutantTurkey | yep |
kb9vqf | thanks |
MutantTurkey | just did that exactly |
kb9vqf | ah, good, you can be trained :)) |
KingSphinx | (yeah, still talking themes for the moment) Oddly, I find that the older KDE themes (oh-so-creatively titled "KDE 1" and "KDE 2") have a charm to their simplicity... just switched to KDE 2's look/icons. :) |
MutantTurkey | how do we mark closed? resolved...? |
kb9vqf | well, that's why I kept them around |
kb9vqf | they are only a few Kb in size anyway |
kb9vqf | MutantTurkey: Resolved Fixed |
MutantTurkey | okay all done |
MutantTurkey | are we going to ever get bugwatch@pearsoncomputing to foreward to the ML? if you care enough |
MutantTurkey | or if you even wanted to. I know I mentioned it |
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kb9vqf | ohhh...oops |
kb9vqf | I forgot entirely |
MutantTurkey | :)) |
kb9vqf | hmmm |
kb9vqf | I don't even want to think about that right now, but.... |
* kb9vqf sets a sticky note for himself |
kb9vqf | not sure if we want to flood the devel list with that stuff |
kb9vqf | but a new list might be good |
kb9vqf | trinity-bugs or something |
MutantTurkey | good call |
kb9vqf | and maybe one more...trinity-commits |
kb9vqf | for when we move to GIT |
MutantTurkey | I think you can do like weekly commit digests |
* kb9vqf does not know how :P |
kb9vqf | but that is in the future |
kb9vqf | MutantTurkey: Can you watch for kcrash actually generating a backtrace? |
MutantTurkey | I haven't had anything crash. |
kb9vqf | for some reason on my testing machine kcrash always comes up with "invalid backgrace" |
kb9vqf | *backtrace |
kb9vqf | and it is good that nothing crashed for you :) |
MutantTurkey | I need to crash something. |
kb9vqf | but I just want to make sure kcrash still works |
kb9vqf | make sure you have the Trinity debug symbols and gdb installed before you try it of course :) |
MutantTurkey | I probably need to go to bed actually :[ |
MutantTurkey | which is really annoying because I am so excited I have trinity running! |
MutantTurkey | its like 3:20am... |
kb9vqf | so...do you like it so far? |
MutantTurkey | of course I do! |
kb9vqf | glad to hear it :)) |
MutantTurkey | a few minor gripes |
kb9vqf | file bug reports and fix them :) |
kb9vqf | j/k ... well ... sort of ... |
MutantTurkey | well there are plenty of bugs to work with as of now |
MutantTurkey | I consider my self the bug admin ninja |
MutantTurkey | I am swooping down on easy to fix ones and knocking them out |
MutantTurkey | the administrative work of moving bugs and checking them out. leaving the coding to you :D |
MutantTurkey | I actually tried to dig into kmail and almost passed out. |
MutantTurkey | I am reading through a dcop vs dbus page now |
kb9vqf | yeah, kinda nasty isn't it (kmail) |
kb9vqf | dcop is here to stay BTW |
MutantTurkey | Its a very large source |
kb9vqf | it can do things that dbus can't |
MutantTurkey | really? |
kb9vqf | and dbus can do things that dcop can't |
MutantTurkey | hurm |
kb9vqf | so they need each other |
MutantTurkey | okay well actually either way I don't care |
kb9vqf | it's all backend stuff anyway |
kb9vqf | and dcop has never given me problems |
MutantTurkey | understood |
kb9vqf | stay away from kdepim |
MutantTurkey | scary? |
kb9vqf | I am probably one of the only people on the planet that understand it |
MutantTurkey | oh godness |
MutantTurkey | I am going to stick with easier things then :) |
kb9vqf | you will be happier :) |
kb9vqf | fortunately kdepim is quite stable |
kb9vqf | only a few niggling issues |
MutantTurkey | my favorite thing about trinity |
MutantTurkey | is that it is tried and tested of a long period of time |
MutantTurkey | very stable in that sense |
MutantTurkey | kb9vqf: what is kio_http? |
kb9vqf | it is the ioslave used to get http data |
MutantTurkey | okay |
kb9vqf | I believe it calls in KHTML to display it |
MutantTurkey | with gnome3 failing miserably and calls for gnome2 forks, and the upcoming release, its a perfect time to fill the void |
kb9vqf | yep |
kb9vqf | which is why I'm not futzing with Qt4 |
kb9vqf | since we absorbed Qt3 I see no reason to switch at this time |
MutantTurkey | my hope is to eventually use trinity as my control desktop for my studio |
kb9vqf | Qt3 has a LOT of life left in it, especially once we get off the Qt namespace |
MutantTurkey | what is the "Qt namespace" |
MutantTurkey | I don't get it :P |
kb9vqf | first some history :) |
kb9vqf | C/C++ uses symbol lookups to get the correct functions within a dhared library |
MutantTurkey | KSirc is nice! well much nicer than kivrc. |
kb9vqf | they look up by name |
MutantTurkey | right, that is familiar |
kb9vqf | ksirc is Trinity? |
MutantTurkey | no idea. somehow i have it. |
kb9vqf | ah |
MutantTurkey | I think it must be |
MutantTurkey | anyway back to Qt namesparce |
kb9vqf | yes it is |
kb9vqf | ok |
kb9vqf | basically, Qt3 cannot be compiled in with Qt4 in the same program for one reason alone: |
kb9vqf | the symbol names would be identical, and the linker would have no idea which version to use |
kb9vqf | e.g. QWidget::show() |
kb9vqf | Qt3 or Qt4? |
kb9vqf | data objects |
kb9vqf | QWidget: which one? |
kb9vqf | etc. |
MutantTurkey | thats terrible |
kb9vqf | That collection of classes is referred to as a namespace |
MutantTurkey | right |
MutantTurkey | so now they all use what instead? |
kb9vqf | well, not exactly, but I'm saying it is :) |
kb9vqf | so if we use TQWidget, TQObject, etc. we can have Qt3 and Qt4 coexist perfectly |
kb9vqf | technically it would then be TQt3 and Qt4 :) |
kb9vqf | you could say we moved our namespace from Qt to TQt |
kb9vqf | no more symbol clashes |
kb9vqf | that also would allow us to use pure Qt4 code where needed |
kb9vqf | within Trinity |
kb9vqf | e.g. :drumroll: Webkit! |
MutantTurkey | but for regular users... no difference |
MutantTurkey | or while compiling? |
kb9vqf | exactly |
kb9vqf | no difference at all, not even when compiling (except that they need to install TQt3, not Qt3) |
MutantTurkey | so from the other side, the distro ecosystem |
kb9vqf | but we are paving the way now with Qt3 in our GIT tree |
MutantTurkey | all they need to do is pull upstream |
kb9vqf | yep |
MutantTurkey | (us) |
MutantTurkey | hrm |
MutantTurkey | have you talked to any distros yet? |
kb9vqf | nope |
kb9vqf | not going to either |
MutantTurkey | okay |
kb9vqf | not yet |
MutantTurkey | understood |
kb9vqf | as far as I'm concerned if Trinity is the last Qt3 app then we can absorb Qt3 without anyone even caring |
kb9vqf | then Qt3 just becomes part of kdelibs |
kb9vqf | so to speak |
kb9vqf | and Trinity should be treated as a pure X application |
kb9vqf | as the only hooks lower than Qt3 are to XLib and friends |
kb9vqf | make sense? |
kb9vqf | Qt3 still can't be beat for speed |
MutantTurkey | Qt3 is faster than qt4 assumed |
kb9vqf | assumed? |
kb9vqf | try it :) |
MutantTurkey | I haven't seen benchmarks :P |
kb9vqf | it is much slower in GFX |
MutantTurkey | but same goes for gtk1x and gtk2 |
kb9vqf | partially due to the new double buffering, etc. |
kb9vqf | (which can't be turned off...grr....) |
MutantTurkey | annoying |
kb9vqf | it's a memory pig |
kb9vqf | the classes are smaller, meaning more code goes into the end application |
kb9vqf | it's good for many smaller apps, but NOT GOOD for a full desktop IMHO |
MutantTurkey | everything new is a memory pig |
MutantTurkey | though kde3 isn't exactly the most conservative :P |
kb9vqf | and you've seen some of the other fun with the QString to double conversions |
MutantTurkey | yeah I've seen it. |
kb9vqf | it's an unstable mess |
kb9vqf | like I said, great for a lot of apps |
kb9vqf | but for huge apps it's a royal pain |
MutantTurkey | i mean, that's something so basic... it should even be a problem. |
kb9vqf | I know |
kb9vqf | now figure how many similar problems there are in codepaths that aren't commonly used on mobile telephones... |
kb9vqf | :yikes: |
kb9vqf | Qt3 is STABLE |
kb9vqf | kind of like Xlib |
MutantTurkey | Xlib is terrible though :P |
kb9vqf | Yes it is |
MutantTurkey | have you seen xcb? |
kb9vqf | ? |
MutantTurkey | it's awesome |
MutantTurkey | it's the new (actually like 2006ish) |
MutantTurkey | standard |
MutantTurkey | X C Bindings, wayy faster. |
kb9vqf | ah |
kb9vqf | no, not really |
MutantTurkey | frankly I hate the whole X11 stack |
MutantTurkey | i think it doesn't make sense for a desktop |
kb9vqf | not sure |
MutantTurkey | the server/client nature of it was good in 1985 with one mainframe. |
kb9vqf | especially with the trend towards mainframes again |
MutantTurkey | good point |
kb9vqf | BTW xcb is not always faster http://lists.freedesktop.org/archives/xcb/2009-February/004321.html |
kb9vqf | It's one of Qt4's problems :P |
MutantTurkey | interesting |
MutantTurkey | I still think xlib is a PITA |
kb9vqf | and Qt3 abstracts us from that |
kb9vqf | I say stick with the tried and true for something as basic as a desktop |
kb9vqf | unless you don't have the features needed |
kb9vqf | which I have yet to come across |
kb9vqf | leave the experimentation to video games and apps that *need* that much power |
kb9vqf | and the risk of instability |
MutantTurkey | right |
kb9vqf | *at |
MutantTurkey | I wish we had something like mac or windows, the video component in the kernel |
MutantTurkey | many people are warey of it |
kb9vqf | we're getting there |
kb9vqf | kms |
MutantTurkey | I know |
kb9vqf | looks good to me |
MutantTurkey | http://microxwin.com |
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MutantTurkey | kernel module x server |
kb9vqf | page is down |
* l0ner is watching silently |
MutantTurkey | performance is crazy better |
kb9vqf | actually I use the nvidia open source driver |
kb9vqf | works well for me *and* I get full XRandR 1.2 support |
MutantTurkey | intel has great support luckily |
kb9vqf | yes |
MutantTurkey | i guess its because it's so simple... :P |
kb9vqf | Intel is very good there |
MutantTurkey | no performance, but all the stability |
kb9vqf | hey...it runs Compiz! |
kb9vqf | yes |
kb9vqf | a workhorse for business |
kb9vqf | actually I'd prefer that |
kb9vqf | once you go to the Quadro series though NVidia is pretty good |
MutantTurkey | alright almost 4am... need to sleep :P |
kb9vqf | yep |
kb9vqf | me too |
MutantTurkey | luckily I have the afternoon shift tomorrow. 1pm! |
MutantTurkey | so still a good 8 hours of sleep |
l0ner | so, form whats is written on the microxwin page, it can be easily used as a replacement for x11? |
MutantTurkey | l0ner: with some work |
MutantTurkey | I have run it following his instructions |
MutantTurkey | basically the problem is that it is a closed source kernel module |
MutantTurkey | (which isn't that ridiculous, seeing as we have plenty of binay driver blobs) |
l0ner | yes |
MutantTurkey | but the theory is there. |
MutantTurkey | if only someone would make an open source version of it. |
l0ner | but because of that it wont get mainstream |
MutantTurkey | If i win lottery, I am purchasing it from him. |
MutantTurkey | :p |
l0ner | good luck ;) |
l0ner | but i have seen somewere something like that |
MutantTurkey | anyway |
l0ner | don't remember where tho |
MutantTurkey | I am going to sleep. |
l0ner | g'nite ;) |
MutantTurkey | I'll talk to you all tomorrow sometime actually thurdsay probably. |
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l0ner | it's strange, people goes tho sleep when I have just woken up |
* l0ner blames(?) TMZ difference |
tbottu | 10New TDE 3.5 bug 487 filed by humanreadable@yahoo.com. |
tbottu | 04Bug http://bugs.pearsoncomputing.net/show_bug.cgi?id=487 normal, P2, ---, kb9vqf, NEW, KPDF Page Scrolling Broken When Using Keyboard |
tbottu | 10kb9vqf@pearsoncomputing.net changed the Status on bug 485 from NEW to RESOLVED FIXED. |
tbottu | 04Bug http://bugs.pearsoncomputing.net/show_bug.cgi?id=485 needs packaging, P5, ---, kb9vqf, RESOLVED FIXED, kbookreader needs packaging |
tbottu | 10New TDE 3.5 bug 488 filed by remibouhl@gmail.com. |
tbottu | 04Bug http://bugs.pearsoncomputing.net/show_bug.cgi?id=488 minor, P5, ---, kb9vqf, NEW, kolourpaint, okular (maybe others) are frozen by defuncted SSHFS mount. |
tbottu | 10New TDE 3.5 bug 489 filed by raevynsrequiem@gmail.com. |
tbottu | 04Bug http://bugs.pearsoncomputing.net/show_bug.cgi?id=489 normal, P5, ---, kb9vqf, RESOLVED FIXED, Pidgin Fails to launch |
tbottu | 10kb9vqf@pearsoncomputing.net changed the Status on bug 489 from NEW to RESOLVED FIXED. |
tbottu | 10mutantturkey@gmail.com changed the Status on bug 484 from NEW to RESOLVED FIXED. |
tbottu | 04Bug http://bugs.pearsoncomputing.net/show_bug.cgi?id=484 enhancement, P5, ---, kb9vqf, RESOLVED FIXED, Qt3 needs patching to build under ARM |
tbottu | 10kb9vqf@pearsoncomputing.net changed the Status on bug 253 from NEW to RESOLVED FIXED. |
tbottu | 04Bug http://bugs.pearsoncomputing.net/show_bug.cgi?id=253 minor, P5, ---, kb9vqf, RESOLVED FIXED, Radio buttons and check boxes do not display properly when toggled |
tbottu | 10mutantturkey@gmail.com changed the Component on bug 408 from kdeutils to debian. |
tbottu | 04Bug http://bugs.pearsoncomputing.net/show_bug.cgi?id=408 normal, P5, ---, kb9vqf, NEW, Conflict, when install basket from KDE4 and from trinity in debian squeeze |
tbottu | 10robxu9@gmail.com changed the Status on bug 459 from NEW to RESOLVED FIXED. |
tbottu | 04Bug http://bugs.pearsoncomputing.net/show_bug.cgi?id=459 blocker, P1, ---, kb9vqf, RESOLVED FIXED, Detecting $KDEHOME to avoid conflicts with KDE3 and KDE4 |
tbottu | 10New TDE 3.5 bug 490 filed by sh4dou@gmail.com. |
tbottu | 04Bug http://bugs.pearsoncomputing.net/show_bug.cgi?id=490 enhancement, P5, ---, kb9vqf, NEW, adding support for PulseAudio application volume control |
tbottu | 10New TDE 3.5 bug 491 filed by sh4dou@gmail.com. |
tbottu | 04Bug http://bugs.pearsoncomputing.net/show_bug.cgi?id=491 enhancement, P5, ---, kb9vqf, NEW, Desktop panel auto length |
tbottu | 10mutantturkey@gmail.com changed the Status on bug 229 from REOPENED to RESOLVED FIXED. |
tbottu | 04Bug http://bugs.pearsoncomputing.net/show_bug.cgi?id=229 normal, P5, ---, kb9vqf, RESOLVED FIXED, include kickoff menu with trinity |
tbottu | 10New TDE 3.5 bug 492 filed by kb9vqf@pearsoncomputing.net. |
tbottu | 04Bug http://bugs.pearsoncomputing.net/show_bug.cgi?id=492 blocker, P5, ---, kb9vqf, NEW, kdmctl cannot parse active sessions |
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KingSphinx | I'm running update-manager to upgrade Trinity to 11.04, but I have a few concerns before I start the upgrade... |
KingSphinx | kde-guidance-kde3, kde-guidance-powermanager-kde3, openoffice.org-kde3, guidance-backends-kde3 and python-kde3-kde3 want to be removed. Are any of these essential? |
Piki | KingSphinx: i don't use ubuntu, so i can't help, but if nobody answers soon, the best thing to do would be to back up your data before upgrading |
KingSphinx | That's fine, I can wait for someone to help. Plus my /home's on a separate partition, so I can just reinstall if something goes wrong. |
Piki | the best suggestion i have there is to see if there are tde equivalents. openoffice.org-kde and python-kde3 shouldn't be needed, those are just extensions, and powermanager should only be needed for laptops or changing cpu frequencies if the cpu supports that |
Piki | not sure about the others |
Xu_R | meepmeep |
Xu_R | hey Piki, KingSphinx |
Xu_R | KingSphinx: only up to 11.04 if you want to use nightly builds... heh... heh... d: |
Xu_R | *D: |
Xu_R | looks like tbottu is working again... after a momentarily spaz in bug reports... |
kb9vqf | those were all the bug reports that were queued up |
kb9vqf | I didn't realize the but watch account was blocked until last night :-/ |
kb9vqf | *bug |
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Xu_R | :-\ |
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Xu_R | kb9vqf: hey, I just noticed something |
Xu_R | ah, damnit, I missed |
Xu_R | I feel happy for openSUSE now :D |
KingSphinx | Why? Did Trinity get ported to it? |
Xu_R | well, KDE3 is back in the main distribution (aka, again supported) |
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Xu_R | I'm the one that's supposed to be porting it to SuSE, so I better work fast XD |
* Xu_R notes however that real-life work is catching up with him... |
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MT | kb9vqf: hey |
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MT | is bug 365 valid? |
tbottu | 04Bug http://bugs.pearsoncomputing.net/show_bug.cgi?id=365 normal, P5, ---, kb9vqf, NEW, GPG Key and Repositories not Accessible |
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KingSphinx | Well, Unity installed without much trouble. Only major issue seems to be that the Ubuntu Software Center doesn't seem to want to install stuff; apt-get is a workaround though. |
MT | I dont like Ubuntu |
MT | they have like 150000 ways to access packaging |
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KingSphinx | "If one breaks, there's another way to get around it" is how I see it |
mutantturkey | kb9vqf: I also closed bug 322 |
tbottu | 04Bug http://bugs.pearsoncomputing.net/show_bug.cgi?id=322 normal, P5, ---, kb9vqf, RESOLVED FIXED, kdegraphics build warnings |
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mutantturkey | yeah... arch has one that never breaks :D |
KingSphinx | Just curious... are you using Trinity in Arch? Didn't think there was an "official" build for that yet... |
mutantturkey | I am working on it. progress has slowed. |
KingSphinx | Ah |
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KingSphinx | Great... I have no sound at all. Not even in Trinity now. |
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Xu_R | DX |
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backwoodsman | anyone awake? |
backwoodsman | anyone know if the Maverick install instructions will work on Natty? |
mutantturkey | hey |
mutantturkey | I think on the hone page there is a news bulletin about natty |
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KingSphinx | Alright, got my sound back... at least for now. :) |
Qu4Z | Yay! |
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MutantTurkey | saw a trinity mention on reddit yesterday |
MutantTurkey | the one complaint: debian only |
MutantTurkey | so geting more distros on it would be great in terms of opening it up |
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MTurkey | kb9vqf: did you see why |
MTurkey | what I said yesterday |
MTurkey | I LT was about a bug |
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l0ner | Just an idea: could someone add informations that compilation of qt3 from your git is required to compile tqt? and how-to would be nice too. |
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Xu_R | kb9vqf: I can't push to tde-packaging |
Xu_R | error: no DAV locking support |
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MutantTurkey | o/ |
kb9vqf | huh? |
MutantTurkey | what's up? |
kb9vqf | Xu_R: How did you check out that repository? |
kb9vqf | sounds like you used the wrong URL |
Xu_R | kb9vqf: nope, used the right URL |
kb9vqf | which was? |
Xu_R | error: no DAV locking support on http://rxu@scm.trinitydesktop.org/scm/git/tde-packaging/ |
Xu_R | fatal: git-http-push failed |
kb9vqf | ah |
Xu_R | or... i'm sure that's the right url ^^" |
kb9vqf | I just committed some stuff of my own earlier today |
kb9vqf | so it *should* be working |
kb9vqf | I assume you are doing "git push origin master"? |
Xu_R | yup |
MutantTurkey | kb9vqf: just letting you know I'll be gone till sunday. but in case the world ends or anything I have email where i'm at |
kb9vqf | Xu_R: Does it ask for a password then fail, or does it fail before the password? |
kb9vqf | ok |
Xu_R | asks for a password twice then fails |
kb9vqf | sounds like a wrong password |
Xu_R | pretty sure it isn't... |
kb9vqf | well it works for me... |
kb9vqf | can you check out a new copy with the same password? |
Xu_R | trying... |
Xu_R | yea, that same password works |
kb9vqf | very odd |
kb9vqf | let me try checking something in |
kb9vqf | Xu_R: Works for me :-/ |
Xu_R | D: |
Xu_R | I'll try again :-\ |
kb9vqf | Xu_R You don't have write access |
kb9vqf | did you cange your password yet? |
kb9vqf | *change |
Xu_R | I changed my password already... |
Xu_R | twice... |
kb9vqf | ok |
kb9vqf | I never granted you access |
Xu_R | >_>" |
kb9vqf | because I didn't know it had been changed yet |
kb9vqf | the default is not secure... |
Xu_R | ah... |
kb9vqf | Xu_R: Fixed :) |
Xu_R | :D |
kb9vqf | don't you hate git's obscure error messages though? |
Xu_R | guess so :-\ |
Xu_R | but a google search came a bit closer :P |
Xu_R | pushed some stuff :D |
kb9vqf | looking good...though I admit I don't know much about the RPM build process ;-) |
Xu_R | hehe ;P and I admit I have no clue about debian packaging |
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Xu_R | kb9vqf: do you think it's ok if I start naming packages like tde-kdelibs instead of kdelibs3 or kdelibs-trinity? |
kb9vqf | how about tdelibs |
kb9vqf | the -trinity extension in Ubuntu/Debian is legacy ;-) |
Xu_R | just start replacing kde with tde now? |
kb9vqf | go ahead since you are starting anew |
Xu_R | ah, ok. because I was thinking that might not be what you would like :) |
kb9vqf | Debian/Ubuntu is a bit trickier because of the relatively long history |
kb9vqf | people are used to searching for *-trinity |
kb9vqf | or *-kde3 |
Xu_R | ah, true |
kb9vqf | I don't want to keep "kde" in the names if we don't have to |
Xu_R | ok |
tbottu | 10mutantturkey@gmail.com changed the Status on bug 322 from NEW to RESOLVED FIXED. |
kb9vqf | grr, bugwatch stalled again |
tbottu | 04Bug http://bugs.pearsoncomputing.net/show_bug.cgi?id=322 normal, P5, ---, kb9vqf, RESOLVED FIXED, kdegraphics build warnings |
tbottu | 10New TDE 3.5 bug 493 filed by kb9vqf@pearsoncomputing.net. |
tbottu | 04Bug http://bugs.pearsoncomputing.net/show_bug.cgi?id=493 needs packaging, P5, ---, kb9vqf, NEW, kkbswitch needs packaging |
Xu_R | tbottu doesn't like bugwatch very much... |
tbottu | Xu_R: Error: "doesn't" is not a valid command. |
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tbottu | 10kb9vqf@pearsoncomputing.net changed the Status on bug 100 from UNCONFIRMED to NEEDINFO. |
tbottu | 04Bug http://bugs.pearsoncomputing.net/show_bug.cgi?id=100 enhancement, P5, ---, kb9vqf, NEEDINFO, Keyboard layout switcher does not work |
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mturkey | hey there |
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sinedeviance | hi all! i was wondering if any of you know how large trinity-desktop is installed? |
sinedeviance | i am asking because i have a debian server that i have installed it onto. my / partition only has the base system, mysql/apache2/php, htop, and trinity-desktop installed, but for some reason my partition is showing 4.5gb of usage. this seems really strange |
sinedeviance | if nobody knows, can you tell me how to completely remove trinity-desktop so i can check my partition size after removal and then reinstall? |
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kb9vqf | Xu_R|ZNC: can you take a look at Bug 100 if you have time? |
tbottu | 04Bug http://bugs.pearsoncomputing.net/show_bug.cgi?id=100 enhancement, P5, ---, kb9vqf, NEEDINFO, Keyboard layout switcher does not work |
kb9vqf | it sounds simple enough to fix |
kb9vqf | (though I would definitely verify that it is still present in the latest SVN before working on it) |
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tbottu | 10New TDE 3.5 bug 494 filed by nick@leverton.org. |
tbottu | 04Bug http://bugs.pearsoncomputing.net/show_bug.cgi?id=494 normal, P5, ---, kb9vqf, NEW, nspluginviewer fix in r1224648 fails with Adobe flash 10.3 and flash 11beta |
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tbottu | 10New TDE 3.5 bug 495 filed by ogldelphi@mail.ru. |
tbottu | 04Bug http://bugs.pearsoncomputing.net/show_bug.cgi?id=495 enhancement, P5, ---, kb9vqf, NEW, add DSL support in knetworkmanager |
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Xu_R | hey MutantTurkey |
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MutantTurkey | hey just got back |
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Xu_R | !seen kb9vqf |
tbottu | Xu_R: kb9vqf was last seen in #trinity-desktop 1 day, 12 hours, 4 minutes, and 47 seconds ago: <kb9vqf> (though I would definitely verify that it is still present in the latest SVN before working on it) |
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Aristide | Hi ! ^^ |
Aristide | Do you have a repositories for SUSE ? |
Xu_R | not yet D: |
* Xu_R is working on his spare time to bring them to SuSE |
Aristide | Ok :) |
Xu_R | I suggest you use KDE:KDE3 for now though. |
Xu_R | (or XFCE ;P) |
Aristide | KDE:KDE3 ... |
Aristide | Ok |
Aristide | Xu_R: So, can i install KDE3 without uninstall KDE4 ? |
Xu_R | Aristide: yes. Both can be installed side by side |
Aristide | Yes |
Aristide | YES ! |
Aristide | I go try to install it o/ |
Xu_R | :D |
Xu_R | There's still an active opensuse-kde3 mailing list~~ |
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a^phorce | l |
tbottu | 10ogldelphi@mail.ru changed the Status on bug 42 from NEEDINFO to CONFIRMED. |
tbottu | 04Bug http://bugs.pearsoncomputing.net/show_bug.cgi?id=42 normal, P5, ---, kb9vqf, CONFIRMED, gtk-qt-engine-kde3 does not work properly |
tbottu | 10ogldelphi@mail.ru changed the Status on bug 429 from NEEDINFO to UNCONFIRMED. |
tbottu | 04Bug http://bugs.pearsoncomputing.net/show_bug.cgi?id=429 normal, P5, ---, kb9vqf, UNCONFIRMED, Kicker crashes because of Esc key |
tbottu | 10ogldelphi@mail.ru changed the Status on bug 429 from UNCONFIRMED to NEEDINFO. |
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MutantTurkey | hey all |
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tbottu | 10kb9vqf@pearsoncomputing.net changed the Status on bug 492 from NEW to RESOLVED FIXED. |
tbottu | 04Bug http://bugs.pearsoncomputing.net/show_bug.cgi?id=492 blocker, P5, ---, kb9vqf, RESOLVED FIXED, kdmctl cannot parse active sessions |
ab__ | you guys are awesome |
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Xu_R | !seen kb9vqf |
tbottu | Xu_R: kb9vqf was last seen in #trinity-desktop 2 days, 18 hours, 54 minutes, and 11 seconds ago: <kb9vqf> (though I would definitely verify that it is still present in the latest SVN before working on it) |
Xu_R | darn it, where is he... |
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l0ner | Xu_R: No prob ;) |
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Xu_R | l0ner: :D |
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tbottu | 10New TDE 3.5 bug 496 filed by ogldelphi@mail.ru. |
tbottu | 04Bug http://bugs.pearsoncomputing.net/show_bug.cgi?id=496 enhancement, P5, ---, kb9vqf, NEW, knetworkmanager-trinity 3.5.12 doesn't work with TDE 3.5.13 |
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MutantTurkey | o/ |
MutantTurkey | Xu_R: saw your page on the etherpad about converting to nightly builds |
Xu_R | MutantTurkey: nice |
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MutantTurkey | Xu_R: also i email tim with an updated relatedproject.php |
MutantTurkey | added qt3 into it |
MutantTurkey | is that good you thjink? |
Xu_R | probably a good idea, since we became upstream... |
MutantTurkey | supossedly :P |
Xu_R | hehe |
tbottu | 10kb9vqf@pearsoncomputing.net changed the Status on bug 496 from NEW to RESOLVED INVALID. |
tbottu | 04Bug http://bugs.pearsoncomputing.net/show_bug.cgi?id=496 normal, P5, ---, kb9vqf, RESOLVED INVALID, knetworkmanager-trinity 3.5.12 doesn't work with TDE 3.5.13 |
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Space_Man | what is best distro to use that is up to date and uses fglrx? |
Space_Man | or has an easy method to install fglrx? |
Xu_R | ubuntu + derivatives, or maybe ATi's repo for openSUSE... iouno truthfully. my ATi card is on windows ;P |
Space_Man | I was thinking about ubuntu, but how do you install the latest version (11.04) with trinity? |
Space_Man | mint debian is another option |
Xu_R | use maverick builds for now, unless you want to use nightly ;P |
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Piki | hi |
strangelv | :: had dependancy problems trying to install TDE Meerkat packages to a Natty USB drive |
strangelv | "Hello |
strangelv | So I'm not suer if Meekrkat packages work with Natty right now |
strangelv | "This was al/slo sthe 32 bit version, which I don't normally use |
* strangelv 's subnotebook/netbook has a 32 bit Centaur CPU |
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Xu_R | strangelv: really? D: |
Xu_R | you wanna try nightly? it's pretty broken, and there's no meta packages, but it's worth a shot if you know what to install ;P |
strangelv | "I might try that sometime, although it was mostly an expecriment. The amin thing I needed to do was reset my clock to before 2002 so fsck wouldn't freak out and prevent mounting of any HD partitions |
strangelv | "I set it to 2 January 1970 |
strangelv | "Up and running right now; may need to repat the exercise if the CMOS doesn't keep enough of a charge. Teed ot buyp a new battery for it. |
* strangelv is too close to falling asleep to ask forl directions for nightly |
strangelv | "My new hardware problem is a monitor that doesn't seem to work with anything newer than Jaunty |
Xu_R | :-\ |
Xu_R | go to sleep, figure it out in the morning. |
strangelv | It's always been delicat eand prone to showing me a screen consitting of a red rectangle with OUT OF RANGE in screaming capitals |
strangelv | "I tried installing Meerkat server, and it goes out of range on text. Linux always changes the text mode a couple of seconds into initialization. That text mode change sends it out of bounds |
strangelv | "Basically, it's completely unusable as a bench display |
* strangelv 's effort to get back up to speed in Python with a wiki page cerating script at least is going okay, not that he's aware of anything that TDE needs scripted in Python |
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Piki | hi |
Xu_R | hello Piki |
Piki | hi Xu_R |
Xu_R | anything new? |
Piki | nope |
Piki | trying to see if BQ is alive. she's apparently online, just not in any channels according to her /whois |
Xu_R | well, she's been busy lately |
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Piki | that was dumb :-( |
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Xu_R | accidental exiting? |
Piki | Xu_R: incorrect comman, typed /quit instead of /part |
Xu_R | nice. |
Piki | so konversation stayed open, but i d/ced from freenode |
Xu_R | I know what /quit is xP |
Piki | some clients actually quit instead of just d/cing :-) |
Xu_R | i know, but I'm talking standard behavior :P |
Xu_R | have you started packaging Trinity for ark? |
Piki | i'm waiting for bero to put out an iso with recent packages included |
Piki | manually upgrading packages via command line seems to be causing a lot of issues for me |
Piki | and AFAIK bero hasn't fixed zypper/apt-rpm |
Xu_R | Piki: you don't need to test the spec files right away - just write them out based on the old ones |
Xu_R | you can test them when a new iso comes out |
Piki | i know, i prefer to do the packages when i do the specs |
Piki | i don't know why, just feels more comfortable for my work flow |
Xu_R | Piki: yea... I know how it feels, but it's going to be a time waster... easier to take the old srpms, unrpm them, mod the spec, and then test later |
Piki | we've wasted a lot of time already, and it's looking like we're not releasing any time soon :-) |
Xu_R | where did you get that? |
Xu_R | we're only stuck on bug fixing? |
Piki | i'm talking ark |
Xu_R | ah, ark. |
Piki | we used to do a release every year, our last release was in 2008, and bero's taking his time with the new iso |
Xu_R | I may have a solution to ark's rpm problem (thanks, jbj) but from therein I don't know. |
Piki | rpm works fine in ark, we just need to either a) setup apt-rpm5, or b) finish porting zypper to rpm5 |
Xu_R | oh, oops. s/rpm/zypper |
Piki | the problem i'm having with manually upgrading is a bad package from bero |
Piki | Xu_R: hmm? |
Xu_R | I meant I have a solution to libzypp/libsatsolver/zypper... |
Piki | ok |
Xu_R | (courtesy of Yacto/Poky Linux) |
Piki | ok |
Xu_R | Piki: oh, and btw, we migrated SVN.td to GIT.td |
Xu_R | Piki: git.trinitydesktop.org |
* Xu_R guesses you already knew that anyway |
Piki | Xu_R: you can email the solution to bero@arklinux.org, he seems to have fixed the mail server to forward to the correct email |
Piki | no, i didn't know |
Xu_R | Piki: I know his email address, just need to make sure he's actually there ;P |
Piki | haven't been paying much attention lately, haven't spent as much time as usual at the computer (no reason, really, just been stressed out lately) |
Piki | Xu_R: his email wasn't working, it existed on arklinux.org and the mail server works correctly, but he was having it forward to his work email, which he had to change when he got his new job, and it works now |
Xu_R | Piki: I knew about it. I know he email address has been working for a while now - I emailed him last month or so and he responded right away. |
Xu_R | it's bero@arklinux.ch |
Piki | that too |
Piki | i normally send it to .org, but the mail server can use both .org and .ch |
Piki | was my version control access migrated from svn to git |
Piki | ? |
Xu_R | Piki: no, you need a new account |
Xu_R | Piki: in addition, no data was kept on the migration |
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Piki | Xu_R: no biggie, i didn't upload anything important |
Piki | i guess i need to email tim? |
Xu_R | yea. |
Piki | email sent |
Piki | being that i'm new to git, i need to ask, would the command be "git clone something"? |
Piki | for a checkout? |
Xu_R | well, yes |
Xu_R | except GIT doesn't do checkouts, it's cloning |
Xu_R | because GIT essentially downloads the whole repo to your folder |
Piki | what's the clone url for tde-packaging? |
Xu_R | you'll get it with your account info |
Piki | ok |
Xu_R | because your clone url needs to have your username in it |
Piki | how do i commit? |
Xu_R | you know what, let me just put a readme file at the root of the repo so that it's easy to get adjusted |
Piki | ok |
Xu_R | Piki: I made the README, it should show up |
Piki | ok |
Xu_R | yup, it showed up now |
Piki | just read it, i'll probably be referring to it a lot until i get used to git :-) |
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Xu_R | it's really not that different |
Xu_R | damnit. hold on, restarting XChat |
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Xu_R | back |
Piki | ok O.o |
* Xu_R actually restarted XChat - ZNC just keeps me online |
Piki | znc? |
Xu_R | yea |
Piki | never heard of it |
Xu_R | znc, bnc, etc... let's you exit your client but keeps you connected and logs while you're not connected |
Piki | is it like where i have a desktop running an irc client with my nick connected, then i can, e.g. use my laptop to connect to the desktop via my local router and attach the client on my laptop to the irc connection already on the desktop? |
Xu_R | Piki: yea. you can have no clients or you can 10 clients |
Xu_R | you'll still be logged in |
Piki | i've also heard of people running a client like irssi in a screen session to remain connected, and they can detach from screen whenever they're leaving the computer |
Xu_R | yea, that's possible. |
ar | Xu_R: all you can the the better thing and run irssi in tmux/screen |
Xu_R | ar: I already have ZNC set up, and it served me well, especially in china, where you can't use ssh. |
Xu_R | I'll stick with my ZNC ^^ |
ar | Xu_R: you can't? |
ar | that's interesting |
Xu_R | ar: nope. cryptography like ssh is banned in china. the biggest PITA ever. |
Xu_R | closest thing to that is webssh, and that is pretty terrible. most websshs are blocked by the great firewall, too. |
ar | i'm running my own "webssh" on my own server |
Piki | webssh is just ssh through a web browser, still cryptography :-) |
ar | http://code.google.com/p/shellinabox/ |
Xu_R | ar: if only (i didn't have a freaking DSL connection) |
Xu_R | Piki: easier than getting portblocked from everywhere. damn ISP. |
Piki | Xu_R: i need to use webssh and webchat at the local community college, they like knowing exactly what we're doing :-) |
Piki | if only i could use an ssh tunnel from behind their firewall :-( |
Piki | but port 22 is blocked, and i'm pretty sure they block the port i use for ssh on my server |
Xu_R | ok, let me try this again. they blocked freenode in china. they blocked ssh ports. they can detect VPN connections and kill them. |
ar | i also have a nice hack on my server |
ar | if i hit a special url via https, the next connection from my current ip gets passed to openvpn instead of httpd |
Xu_R | ar: wow, nice |
ar | nothing special. just a simple cgi script with extra permisions and a bit of iptables magic |
Xu_R | not bad. |
ar | had an idea about actually making it a proper webapp with "special urls" being usable only once and randomly generated |
ar | but, as always, time's an issue |
Xu_R | always is |
Xu_R | detach #opensuse-buildservice |
Xu_R | eek, oops. |
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Xu_R | scheduled a bug day (august meeting) for next tuesday |
Xu_R | this was long overdue. |
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Qu4Z | Hm... are there any plans to fix konqueror's file browsing ability? It used to be half decent, now it's decidedly sub-par. Which is a shame, 'cause it's an awesome program. |
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Piki | hi |
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Xu_R | why hello thar people |
Space_Man | hi Piki, Xu_R |
Xu_R | hey Space_Man |
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strangelv | Qu4Z: what seems to be broken? |
strangelv | "...and what are you running |
strangelv | :: isn't have thourble, but he's still running Meerkat TDE Kubuntu |
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tbottu | 10New TDE 3.5 bug 497 filed by kb9vqf@pearsoncomputing.net. |
tbottu | 04Bug http://bugs.pearsoncomputing.net/show_bug.cgi?id=497 enhancement, P5, ---, kb9vqf, NEW, run dialog enhancement |
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MutantTurkey | Xu_R: ilya said he has patches for hal? |
MutantTurkey | thats aweome |
Xu_R | MutantTurkey: he claims that. |
Xu_R | but I haven't seen anything to indicate that |
Xu_R | in fact, he was asking about reincluding HAL into factory, so I think he's just making that up in the end. |
* Xu_R notes that I may have missed something |
Xu_R | yea, Ilya seems to be bragging. |
Xu_R | The closest I can come to what he says is some udev rules about automounting |
Xu_R | (and that has nothing to do with integration with KDE3) |
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MutantTurkey | okay. |
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KingSphinx | Assuming packages aren't ready in time for Ocelot, will upgrading to 11.10 be the same situation as the 10.10-11.04 deal or will additonal steps need to be taken? |
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tbottu | 10New TDE 3.5 bug 498 filed by ogldelphi@mail.ru. |
tbottu | 04Bug http://bugs.pearsoncomputing.net/show_bug.cgi?id=498 normal, P5, ---, kb9vqf, NEW, moreblue-orbit-moodin doesn't look correct on widescreen |
tbottu | 10New TDE 3.5 bug 499 filed by nick@leverton.org. |
tbottu | 04Bug http://bugs.pearsoncomputing.net/show_bug.cgi?id=499 minor, P5, ---, kb9vqf, NEW, Knotes resizing corner doesn't always activate on focus |
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tbottu | 10kb9vqf@pearsoncomputing.net changed the Status on bug 499 from NEW to RESOLVED FIXED. |
tbottu | 04Bug http://bugs.pearsoncomputing.net/show_bug.cgi?id=499 minor, P5, ---, kb9vqf, RESOLVED FIXED, Knotes resizing corner doesn't always activate on focus |
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Space_Man | woo hoo, I'm now using trinity 3.5.12 but what has happened to knemo and kdegames? |
Space_Man | installed kubuntu 10.10 and then upgraded to 11.04 |
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tbottu | 10New TDE 3.5 bug 500 filed by kb9vqf@pearsoncomputing.net. |
tbottu | 04Bug http://bugs.pearsoncomputing.net/show_bug.cgi?id=500 needs packaging, P5, ---, kb9vqf, NEW, Add window docking application to Trinity |
tbottu | 10New TDE 3.5 bug 501 filed by e_r_i_c@gmx.net. |
tbottu | 04Bug http://bugs.pearsoncomputing.net/show_bug.cgi?id=501 normal, P5, ---, kb9vqf, NEW, Sylpheed 3.0.2 crashes on saving an attachment |
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tbottu | 10New TDE 3.5 bug 502 filed by ogldelphi@mail.ru. |
tbottu | 04Bug http://bugs.pearsoncomputing.net/show_bug.cgi?id=502 enhancement, P5, ---, kb9vqf, NEW, backport dolphin kde4 "show some pics from a directory on folder icon" feature |
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MutantTurkey | jumpship: I put down 20 |
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MutantTurkey | storms... |
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cpatrick08 | hi |
MutantTurkey | hi! |
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cpatrick08 | sorry about that printscreen was putting alot of screens out |
cpatrick08 | i love this os so much good job |
jumpship | Yeah, it's nice to see someone take this on, these guys are gods in my book |
cpatrick08 | now if somebody could fork gnome 2 then both gnome 3 and kde 4 haters would be happy |
Qu4Z | Mentioning Gnome in a kde channel... you're trading on dangerous ground :P |
Qu4Z | *treading |
cpatrick08 | yea |
jumpship | I think the Gnome2 crowd might be happy with XFCE, I didn't care for either, but XFCE seemed pretty similar to Gnome2 (or at least on it's way there) |
cpatrick08 | true |
Qu4Z | But you're right. What is it with DE developers and suddenly going off and doing their own completely useless thing :/ |
cpatrick08 | it looks like it is for tablets just like unity looks like it is for tablets also |
jumpship | but without Trinity I'd have been left in the cold when Debian moved to KDE4 |
Qu4Z | Tablets are overrated |
jumpship | I think they got bored |
cpatrick08 | yea Tablets are overrated |
Qu4Z | I'd buy one if it came with a wallmount and a dvi port and I could use it as an extra monitor for my desktop, though :P |
jumpship | I'm only interested when a cell or similar service lets me connect it live to my desktop |
cpatrick08 | the only touch thing i like is the ipod touch |
Qu4Z | I dunno. I think if I could use it as a monitor most of the time, sync files to it wirelessly, and then take it with me when I left I'd be vaguely interested. |
jumpship | like a mobile thin client |
Qu4Z | jumpship: My concern there would be latency |
Qu4Z | Unresponsive interfaces are a PITA |
jumpship | sure, the tech isn't there yet, and the services seem to be moving to wrong way |
Qu4Z | Yeah, if it were responsive, that'd be awesome. |
cpatrick08 | that is true |
jumpship | even being able to do it over wifi around the house would be nice, but the price is too high for what I want right now |
cpatrick08 | yea tablets do cost alot |
Qu4Z | Well, if it were usable as a monitor the rest of the time that'd offset the cost a bit for me, I think. |
Qu4Z | But yes, they're friggin' expensive. |
jumpship | I'd really like a modular mobile setup, sorta like how open a desktop is, but portable |
jumpship | I would spend the money on a tablet if I could find one with a line in for audio, for less than $400, but I havn't see one yet |
cpatrick08 | the Coby Kyros MID7015 7-Inch Android has that for less than $200 http://www.amazon.com/Coby-MID7015-Android-Internet-Touchscreen/dp/B0047Q9GT4 |
cpatrick08 | it has a hdmi slot and a usb 2.0 slot |
Qu4Z | I really want to just take a subset of my PC with me :P |
Qu4Z | Like, the keyboard, and a screen. Plug them together, and ... TADA |
jumpship | I see those, that would be nice, but I didn't see a line in, my goal would be to use linux with jack on top, I think it would be cool to use it as a dsp |
jumpship | wouldn't vnc or rdp let you use it as a second monitor, I seem to remember a system for using a second computer to drive a second monitor, don't know how well it would work, but sounds like fun to try |
cpatrick08 | i am running trinity on the maverick and i was wonderig if anybody has tried it on squeeze if so is it better than the ubuntu tde |
jumpship | I use squeeze, I havn't tried Ubuntu, but I think Ubuntu is what the developers use |
cpatrick08 | ok you like it i was thinking bout switching from ubuntu to squeeze tde |
jumpship | It's hard to say, they are very similar, I like Debian, but I've had a few little problems I suspect are because the developers use Ubuntu, for example Ubuntu uses sudo and Debian uses su, you can use either with both I guess |
jumpship | The current bug of the week is a good example of the problems I've seen |
cpatrick08 | yea so what problems do you face jumpship |
jumpship | I switched to using sudo instead of su to avoid the bug, other than that I can't remember exactly, I don't know that TDE is really any different in either |
cpatrick08 | yea but i herd the debian base is more stable than the ubuntu base |
jumpship | I guess it depends on what you mean by stable, as in not changing or not crashing |
cpatrick08 | less bugs |
jumpship | I really couldn't say about ubuntu, but Squeeze has been very good to me |
jumpship | You might try the mailing list, noone seems to be in here today |
cpatrick08 | ok |
cpatrick08 | gotta go ttyl |
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tbottu | 10New TDE 3.5 bug 503 filed by ogldelphi@mail.ru. |
tbottu | 04Bug http://bugs.pearsoncomputing.net/show_bug.cgi?id=503 enhancement, P5, ---, kb9vqf, NEW, kmix wont autostart |
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Kodo_ | hello |
Kodo_ | i've just installed trinity desktop, and run into a problem.. |
Kodo_ | i try to mount a home where i've used kde 3.5.10; i have already found out that i had to rename .kde to .trinity |
Kodo_ | but still, i can't seem to access my Desktop folder in the appropriate way |
Kodo_ | my home-folder is shown on my desktop |
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tbottu | 10New TDE 3.5 bug 504 filed by ogldelphi@mail.ru. |
tbottu | 04Bug http://bugs.pearsoncomputing.net/show_bug.cgi?id=504 enhancement, P5, ---, kb9vqf, NEW, [PaperCut] search kickoff menu bug/enhancement |
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MutantTurkey | Xu_R: dude... |
MutantTurkey | this is ridiculous |
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MutantTurkey | Xu_R: so the kicker bug i will marked closed |
MutantTurkey | if i can find it... |
Xu_R | MutantTurkey: srry for delay, have to go out now |
Xu_R | D: |
* Xu_R was just scrambling around for something |
MutantTurkey | except band just got here :P |
Xu_R | o. |
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KingSphinx | Any idea what's going to happen when Ubuntu rolls over to GTK3? Will QtCurve take care of themeing GTK apps or is there something else that needs to be done? |
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kb9vqf | Hi all |
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kb9vqf | Xu_R: http://git.trinitydesktop.org/viewgit/index.php?a=tree&p=Trinity%20Desktop%20Environment&hb=HEAD&f=main/thirdparty/libreoffice/3.3.2/patches |
kb9vqf | :) |
kb9vqf | Not TQt converted yet, but functional with LibreOffice |
kb9vqf | It took a LONG time to get that to work |
kb9vqf | the OOO/LibreOffice build system is a royal pain |
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zacario | hi |
zacario | is it possible to display a search bar in konqueror? |
Xu_R | kb9vqf: nice :D |
kb9vqf | Xu_R: When is the bug day anyway? |
Xu_R | kb9vqf: it was supposed to be today... |
kb9vqf | ohh |
kb9vqf | great :( |
kb9vqf | are you still stuck on arts? |
kb9vqf | Xu_R: ^^^ |
Xu_R | kb9vqf: yea :-\ |
kb9vqf | Xu_R: Look at the CMake D options here: http://git.trinitydesktop.org/viewgit/index.php?a=viewblob&p=Trinity%20Desktop%20Environment%20Packaging&h=7be8b00579ccf2169b9c4df673baa4962bc190e4&hb=HEAD&f=ubuntu/maverick/dependencies/arts/debian/rules |
kb9vqf | (the line beginning with DEB_CMAKE_EXTRA_FLAGS) |
kb9vqf | see what is different in your build |
Xu_R | ok, will look |
kb9vqf | let me know if you see anything different |
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Xu_R | kb9vqf: I put a lot more flags, but it should have had the same effect... I think I need to look for a missing dependency... |
kb9vqf | Xu_R: Can you pastebin the failure again? |
kb9vqf | note that I need the entire build log |
Xu_R | kb9vqf: http://slexy.org/view/s21O10uz5j |
tbottu | 10kb9vqf@pearsoncomputing.net changed the Status on bug 503 from NEW to NEEDINFO. |
tbottu | 04Bug http://bugs.pearsoncomputing.net/show_bug.cgi?id=503 enhancement, P5, ---, kb9vqf, NEEDINFO, kmix wont autostart |
kb9vqf | Xu_R: Can I see this patch: arts-vorbis-fix.dif |
Xu_R | http://slexy.org/view/s2wuFAPtUn |
kb9vqf | Xu_R: Can you send me the CMake cache from that build? |
kb9vqf | Specifically I want to know what VORBISFILE_LIBRARIES was set to |
Xu_R | kb9vqf: I'm currently running that same build again (no changes), so I'll be able to give you a fresh cache... |
kb9vqf | ok |
kb9vqf | thanks |
kb9vqf | Xu_R: I assume you did pull the latest SVN before rebuilding though? |
Xu_R | yup |
kb9vqf | ok, good |
kb9vqf | my hunch is that -lvorbisfile is not being passed to the gsl linker |
kb9vqf | but I will see shortly |
Xu_R | ok |
Xu_R | hmm... I can confirm I have all the dependencies needed to link vorbis. so it's not a dependency problem |
Xu_R | kb9vqf: I hope you didn't mind that I put README.GIT at the root of tde-packaging ^_^" |
kb9vqf | just a copy of the one in tde? |
kb9vqf | that's fine |
kb9vqf | Xu_R: Can I see the cache files? |
Xu_R | right on time, the build just failed exactly as you sent me that message |
Xu_R | getting the files |
Xu_R | http://slexy.org/view/s20LRUSVgO |
kb9vqf | Xu_R: Can you try this: In arts/flow/gsl/CMakeLists.txt try adding ${VORBIS_LIBRARIES} right after ${VORBISFILE_LIBRARIES} (make sure there is a space between the two ${..} ${..} structures) |
kb9vqf | then rebuild |
kb9vqf | it might not do anything but it's worth a shot |
Xu_R | ok |
Xu_R | ok, rebuilding |
Xu_R | kb9vqf: and btw, the README.GIT in tde-packaging isn't the same as in tde ^_^" lol, didn't know there was one in tde :P |
kb9vqf | http://git.trinitydesktop.org/viewgit/index.php?a=viewblob&p=Trinity%20Desktop%20Environment&h=121b8495bc2f727c92284ce75b8c1524bef5bcbc&hb=1a436852966432ac4be3d4890b3f46c9584d7892&f=README.GIT |
Xu_R | ah, ok... mine was more of just all the commands you would need to use ;P |
kb9vqf | which one do you like better? |
Xu_R | I was just thinking of merging the two - both of them are good |
kb9vqf | ok |
kb9vqf | merge them in tde-packaging |
kb9vqf | I'll look over the result and make final changes before putting it in tde |
kb9vqf | how is the build? |
Xu_R | ok |
Xu_R | still building |
kb9vqf | is that a good sign? |
kb9vqf | i.e. would it have failed before now? |
Xu_R | no, because it hasn't gotten up to that part yet |
kb9vqf | ok |
kb9vqf | your build log isn't very useful TBH |
kb9vqf | debian will say "leaving directory xxx" when the build fails |
kb9vqf | yours does not :( |
kb9vqf | where xxx is the directory containing the failing library build |
Xu_R | it doesn't? |
Xu_R | strange, I thought it does... |
Xu_R | kb9vqf: I can confirm that fix does work |
kb9vqf | Great! :)) |
kb9vqf | I'm going to dinner; poke me a bit later so that I can upload it to SVN |
Xu_R | ok |
kb9vqf | Xu_R: Fixed in SVN revision 1248403 |
Xu_R | kb9vqf: thanks ^_^ |
kb9vqf | np |
kb9vqf | I assume this will help with your RPM builds ;-) |
Xu_R | of course ;) |
Xu_R | wonderful, arts finished building :D |
kb9vqf | great! |
kb9vqf | poke me if you have any other problems |
Xu_R | ok |
Xu_R | kb9vqf: and I revised README.GIT :) http://git.trinitydesktop.org/viewgit/?a=viewblob&p=Trinity%20Desktop%20Environment%20Packaging&h=65c5312e3ec11db32bdc8b90c1da47ca3b12c9cc&hb=6507e11446a26cf7882ecc8658e505b6adce8e61&f=README.GIT |
* Xu_R just spotted a typo - oops. |
* Xu_R goes to fix that typo ;) |
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* strangelv reads an emoil that there was a meeting 46 minutes ago. |
kb9vqf | Xu_R: Did I manage to miss the meeting? |
kb9vqf | I thought it was Tuesday |
Xu_R | I guess I'll push it to Tuesday then. |
Xu_R | It was supposed to be today |
Xu_R | bug day + meeting |
Xu_R | D: |
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kb9vqf | ah |
kb9vqf | sorry about that |
kb9vqf | our dev team seems to be falling apart |
kb9vqf | oh well |
kb9vqf | we may just end up using the nightly builds for a while |
kb9vqf | in the absence of bug fixes I can't release 3.5.13 |
Xu_R | true. MutantTurkey managed to get some bugs closed, and I'm not seeing anything that would block Trinity on my 11.04 except kdesudo :-| |
kb9vqf | how is kdesudo now? |
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kb9vqf | it was rebuilt in the past few days |
kb9vqf | odd--I didn't see any code from MutantTurkey :-/ |
kb9vqf | so they must have been invalid reports |
Xu_R | kb9vqf: kdesudo is still not working D': |
Xu_R | kb9vqf: probably. |
kb9vqf | ok |
kb9vqf | I'll look into it |
kb9vqf | You keep working on the RPM packages |
kb9vqf | we need those ASAP |
kb9vqf | so that OpenSUSE can throw some of its developers our way ;-) |
Xu_R | :) |
kb9vqf | Xu_R: Which version of kdesudo do you have installed? |
Xu_R | latest - from today's updates... |
Xu_R | (I updated today) |
kb9vqf | Xu_R: what exactly happens? |
kb9vqf | the reason I ask is it works fine here (!?!??) |
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Xu_R | kb9vqf: really? it still does nothing on my end |
Xu_R | same errors |
MutantTurkey | hey |
MutantTurkey | band just left |
kb9vqf | Xu_R: Which version? |
kb9vqf | dpkg -l | grep kdesudo |
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Xu_R | 4:3.5.13-0ubuntu7+r1246260+pr1~natty |
Xu_R | kb9vqf: also, what is /opt/trinity/lib/libgsl.a considered? a devel file? |
kb9vqf | it's a static library |
kb9vqf | on Ubuntu that's a development file |
Xu_R | hm... ok |
Xu_R | does arts require it to function? |
* Xu_R also wonders if arts can be built without making a static library |
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Xu_R | woah o_o updating nightly again did something nice to my desktop |
Xu_R | created lots of duplicate icons |
Xu_R | that I can't get rid of... |
Xu_R | this calls for a restart of the computer! and a hope that kdesudo works again |
Xu_R | b/c I just did a full reinstall of it |
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kb9vqf | Xu_R: A restart will clear it |
kb9vqf | the icons that is |
Xu_R | yup - restarted |
Xu_R | kdesudo works |
Xu_R | except calling kdesudo and nothing else still gives an error |
kb9vqf | by itself you mean? |
kb9vqf | just 'kdesudo' ? |
kb9vqf | that gives an error here too |
kb9vqf | a hang up technically |
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Xu_R | kb9vqf: yes |
kb9vqf | Xu_R: Fixed in SVN revision 1248417 |
kb9vqf | theoretically |
Xu_R | now time to test ;) |
kb9vqf | it won't be build for a while |
kb9vqf | but you can cherry-pick the patch |
kb9vqf | from SVN |
kb9vqf | *built |
Xu_R | I'll wait for the builds, there might be other goodies :) |
kb9vqf | ok |
kb9vqf | I actually have a bit in the pipeline right now :-P |
kb9vqf | the final move from kde3 to trinity |
Xu_R | :D |
kb9vqf | literally replacing the string 'kde3' with 'trinity' |
kb9vqf | s/final/next-to-last/g |
kb9vqf | there is one more that needs to be done sometime |
kb9vqf | replacing the string 'KDE3' with 'Trinity' |
kb9vqf | that's a bit nastier |
kb9vqf | but I did it in the Debian/Ubuntu packaging :)( |
kb9vqf | just not in the Trinity source itself |
kb9vqf | anyway builds could take a couple days |
Xu_R | ok |
Xu_R | it'll make the Trinity stand out and the KDE3 begone ^__^ |
kb9vqf | yup |
kb9vqf | and also fix the problems with adept and a handful of other apps that retained "kde3" in their innards |
kb9vqf | oh, and there won't be /opt/trinity/lib/kde3 anymore |
kb9vqf | only /opt/trinity/lib/trinity |
kb9vqf | :) |
Xu_R | :D |
kb9vqf | but as I said...that's a big build batch... |
kb9vqf | it could fail.... |
kb9vqf | and take a few days |
Xu_R | hopefully not |
* kb9vqf crosses fingers |
Xu_R | I already replaced every "kde3" in packaging into "tde", so I might be a first-look |
kb9vqf | keep working on getting preliminary RPM builds |
Xu_R | yes... I need those. |
kb9vqf | don't worry too much about which files go where |
kb9vqf | just get something working |
kb9vqf | then it can be tweaked later |
* Xu_R notes that Ilya has been getting a bit noisier lately... |
kb9vqf | yup |
kb9vqf | and it's up to you to silence him with shiny new packages :) |
kb9vqf | Although I note that every time I ask him for a patch he shuts up for a while |
kb9vqf | and I never get the patch :-/ |
Xu_R | the udev "patch"? it was a bluff, truthfully. |
Xu_R | it's actually a udev automount event |
kb9vqf | well I wasn't far off with the "troll" bit then |
Xu_R | that has nothing to do with integration :-\ |
Xu_R | yes, I noticed he was asking about udev rules and automounting in opensuse Factory mailing list |
Xu_R | connected the two :-| |
kb9vqf | Someone needs to build this http://www.trinitydesktop.org/wiki/bin/view/Developers/KPowerAPI |
kb9vqf | I'm not going to hack yet another hardware access library just to have the underlying specs change again |
kb9vqf | if it's done it will be done RIGHT |
kb9vqf | until then HAL will remain just a prereq |
kb9vqf | *just remain |
Xu_R | good idea... |
kb9vqf | really, there's nothing wrong with HAL |
kb9vqf | there never was |
kb9vqf | it just didn't extend very well or something |
kb9vqf | but Trinity doesn't use those new features...so... |
kb9vqf | :) |
Xu_R | :D |
kb9vqf | we can sit on HAL for a while IMHO |
Xu_R | HAL is still usable, so it's fine. |
kb9vqf | right |
kb9vqf | and there are more pressing concerns |
kb9vqf | like getting the *bugs fixed* and the next release out the door... :)) |
Xu_R | a point very emphasized ;) |
kb9vqf | (I'm considering the lack of RPM support a bug right now) |
Xu_R | ok |
kb9vqf | get the core system working at the very least |
Xu_R | ok |
kb9vqf | that is, the kde* modules |
kb9vqf | and a handful of the apps |
kb9vqf | amarok, kpowersave, etc. |
kb9vqf | enough to get Ilya or others on board and they can help out with the rest |
Xu_R | ok |
kb9vqf | My time will be limited very shortly |
Xu_R | time to speed up packaging... |
Xu_R | ah, even more important then. |
kb9vqf | so I will have to leave the project alone for a while |
kb9vqf | yes |
kb9vqf | Hence the big push to get remaining problems fixed |
Xu_R | ok |
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Xu_R | kb9vqf: hm... looks like Ilya may have tried to do automounting without hal via mtab instead of udev rules |
Xu_R | kb9vqf: http://slexy.org/view/s2NtukzskF |
Xu_R | and now off to bed - night |
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tbottu | 10New TDE 3.5 bug 505 filed by ogldelphi@mail.ru. |
tbottu | 04Bug http://bugs.pearsoncomputing.net/show_bug.cgi?id=505 enhancement, P5, ---, kb9vqf, NEW, kgtk-qt3 3.5.13 nightly can't be used |
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delight | Is trinity installable next to a kde4 installation ? e.g. does it use a .kde-trinity ? what about commands like konsole, konqueror etc. that are available in both versions |
delight | ? |
kb9vqf | delight: Yes, you can install Trinity alongside KDE4 |
kb9vqf | it does use its own ~/.kde3 or ~/.trinity folder (depending on the version you install) |
kb9vqf | Trinity will always launch its version of an application if it is available |
kb9vqf | otherwise it will fall back to the KDE4 version |
kb9vqf | Likewise, KDE4 will always launch its version of an application |
delight | kb9vqf: thnx for the info ... sounds nice ... what about if you use the shell ? |
kb9vqf | shell? |
delight | bash .. .command line |
kb9vqf | from within a trinity session the above is true |
kb9vqf | if you use the shell outside a Trinity session then only the KDE4 versions of the apps are available |
delight | say you are on the shell and want to call something like "kate sometext.txt" |
kb9vqf | that will work |
kb9vqf | If you are logged into a Trinity session, then it will load the Trinity version of kate with "sometext.txt" opened |
kb9vqf | if not, it will load the KDE4 version of Kate |
delight | sounds great ... I'll give it a shot on my debian box ;) ... got natty on my laptop ... |
kb9vqf | OK :) |
delight | thnx for the infos |
kb9vqf | let us know if you run into problems |
kb9vqf | np |
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Piki | hi |
delight | kb9vqf: a last one ... is trinity comming with amarok 1.4.x ? |
kb9vqf | yes |
delight | nice |
kb9vqf | we maintain it actually |
delight | wow |
kb9vqf | nothing else like it out there :) |
delight | true |
delight | ;) |
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Piki | any android users? |
Xu_R | kb9vqf: started on tdebase |
Xu_R | but I'm not going to have much time this week |
Xu_R | it's the week before school X_X |
kb9vqf | Xu_R: OK |
kb9vqf | I take it arts/kdelibs are working? |
Xu_R | yes |
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Xu_R | kb9vqf: hmm... on kde3 (and by extension, kde4) configure options, there is a --with-distribution or a -DKDE_DISTRIBUTION option to specify a distribution name... |
Xu_R | anything like that for trinity? |
kb9vqf | yep |
kb9vqf | well, I was pretty sure, hang on |
kb9vqf | it used to exist in automake |
kb9vqf | Xu_R It used to be "--with-distribution="Kubuntu (`lsb_release --codename --short`)" in Autotools |
kb9vqf | I don't know if that feature was ported to CMake |
Xu_R | hmm... looking at CMakeLists.txt, it wasn't. |
kb9vqf | well, feel free to port it and send me a patch :-P |
Xu_R | ok, when time comes around |
kb9vqf | thanks |
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simcop2387 | has anyone tried getting kdirstat working with trinity desktop? |
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kb9vqf | simcop2387: kdirstat is in our archive |
simcop2387 | cool, i've had a hell of a time keeping a statically built copy of it around and working. there's nothing else like it and i couldn't get it ported up to kde4/qt4 to keep it otherwise |
kb9vqf | yep |
kb9vqf | Qt4 is pretty limiting |
kb9vqf | we have tried to absorb as many KDE3 apps as possible |
kb9vqf | there are many out there that only have equivalents under Windows or Mac |
simcop2387 | i'm mostly after a bastard hybrid of kde3/kde4 these days. i've grown to really like kwin4 and a few other kde4 apps, but hate plasma. |
simcop2387 | but if you guys keep the other stuff alive i could see myself switching back. at 3.6 i'm likely to give it a really serious chance. |
kb9vqf | good to know |
kb9vqf | what do you like in kwin4 that we don't have? |
simcop2387 | honestly it's been so long that i don't remember anymore, but i'm getting a debian vm setup to try trinity right now. (qt3 and hal are the biggest blockers for me, qt3 i can manage but hal gets in the way for me anymore) |
kb9vqf | hal isn't that bad... |
kb9vqf | it just sits in the background |
simcop2387 | it is when it's no longer supported by your dist and lots of packages in the package manager actively say they can't be installed if it is |
Piki | hal crashes a lot on my system |
* kb9vqf notes that in the current nightly builds we have basic compositing support, and work is being done to make Trinity more compositing aware |
kb9vqf | ugh |
kb9vqf | problem is there is no good replacement for HAL |
kb9vqf | and writing one is going to take a while |
Piki | kpowersave constantly loses the battery because of hal |
simcop2387 | at least for all of hal anyway. there's udisks and upower for two small parts, nothing else that i know of |
kb9vqf | I personally would like to see the kernel/udev stuff settle down more before writing a new library for it |
kb9vqf | after all the upheval lately I don't trust udisks/upower to stay around in any semblance of a stable API for a while |
kb9vqf | *upheval |
kb9vqf | *upheavall |
* kb9vqf just cannot type |
kb9vqf | Also, I provide HAL for debian in the package archives |
kb9vqf | it is bad packaging to conflict with it |
kb9vqf | hal-trinity IIRC |
simcop2387 | my main dist isn't debian |
kb9vqf | ubuntu? |
kb9vqf | or something else :) |
simcop2387 | gentoo |
kb9vqf | ah, ok |
Piki | kb9vqf: i think bero had something other than hal working with kde3 back in 2008 and older, i know it wasn't udev/udisks/upower, you can ask him about it |
kb9vqf | another obsolete API probably |
kb9vqf | I really would like to wait and let things settle |
Piki | maybe, but it worked |
kb9vqf | so does HAL ;-) |
Piki | not for me |
Piki | it's always crashing here |
kb9vqf | For the record, I would like to see it replaced as well |
kb9vqf | but I have yet to see an actual viable alternative |
Piki | what bero used sometimes forgot to unload my flash drive drivers, but it worked perfectly otherwise |
kb9vqf | it would cost serious man-hours (read: $$$$) to produce a HAL replacement for Trinity at this point |
kb9vqf | it involves some serious low level programming |
kb9vqf | have you seen the APIs for udev? |
kb9vqf | nasty stuff there |
Piki | i don't even know how to program, so i couldn't look |
kb9vqf | ah |
kb9vqf | Like I said, I wish I could just replace HAL, but it is not trivial to do so |
Piki | if something viable does come along, i'd be willing to test |
Piki | but it would be awhile before i could develop for it |
kb9vqf | and by the time I do, the upstream devs will probably come out with a new latest-and-greatest interface to replace the current upower one |
kb9vqf | that's my main concern |
Piki | at this point i wouldn't know where to start, but i'll start learning soon |
kb9vqf | ok |
simcop2387 | from what i remember on the hal dev lists, it's biggest problem was that they had some architectural issues (i remember huge discussions every couple of months about if it should do mounting itself and how) and it being difficult to get any significant change into the presentation to things using it |
kb9vqf | yes, and those are the same characteristics that made it easy to use on the app level |
kb9vqf | the HAL code in Trinity is minimal |
kb9vqf | when you start talking about using udev directly, the code will bloat like crazy |
Piki | and believe me when i say: if i get into a project that i want/need something, i do it well |
kb9vqf | needing a new library, properly designed APIs, etc. |
Piki | anyways, i need to get going, early start tomorrow |
kb9vqf | ok |
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simcop2387 | yea i don't remember kde doing huge amounts with it, just waiting for disks and maybe some power management stuff (my hardware back then didn't do acpi correctly so i didn't get to see that) |
kb9vqf | yup |
kb9vqf | very hard to "just do that" with udev |
kb9vqf | you need a full fledged interface library |
kb9vqf | which doesn't exist yet |
simcop2387 | i also seem to remember hal before udev itself being a bit of black magic to get events from the kernel, which i think lead to some of the strange looking things in it later on |
simcop2387 | moving targets suck :) |
kb9vqf | yes, and udev may not be able to fully replace HAL as a result |
kb9vqf | there was talk about using devicekit |
kb9vqf | I just can't afford to do this unless someone wants to sponsor it |
kb9vqf | I did write a spec for the new library: http://www.trinitydesktop.org/wiki/bin/view/Developers/KPowerAPI |
simcop2387 | hmm |
kb9vqf | personally I |
kb9vqf | personally I'd rather someone else implemented that library, but I can dream, can't I? :-) |
simcop2387 | i may look into doing some of it, or sponsoring something since i've got a job finally. all depends on my time |
kb9vqf | ok, sounds good |
kb9vqf | let me know what you decide |
kb9vqf | when you decide it (no rush) |
kb9vqf | from my perspective HAL isn't a major problem |
simcop2387 | i wil admit if i do anything it will likely not be done fast, since i've not looked at the stuff it'd involve |
kb9vqf | oh and BTW we absorbed Qt3 |
kb9vqf | we are maintaining it |
kb9vqf | and providing packages for it |
simcop2387 | yea i saw tghat |
simcop2387 | that* |
simcop2387 | fixed a few security issues with it too i think i read? |
kb9vqf | yes |
kb9vqf | so essentially you can look at Trinity as just sitting on top of XLib and friends :) |
kb9vqf | qt3 is just a common shared toolkit between native Trinity apps |
kb9vqf | we're also working on improving compatibility between our version of Qt3 and the "real" Qt4 |
kb9vqf | Qt3 is just so much faster than Qt4 |
simcop2387 | i mostly see qt4 as a move in a good direction for the future since it'd reduce maintence on yourself (in theory) and because qt4 will supposidly support other display systems (like wayland and i think some work on direct framebuffer stuff) |
kb9vqf | actually it makes our job 100x harder |
kb9vqf | Qt4 is another stupid shifting target |
kb9vqf | it's slow |
kb9vqf | it's buggy |
simcop2387 | huh |
kb9vqf | A lot of those irritating KDE4 bugs didn't come from KDE ;-) |
kb9vqf | They came from underlying Qt4 problems |
simcop2387 | i hadn't seen much issues with it myself, but then again i've not tried to make a DE in it :) |
kb9vqf | yep |
kb9vqf | KDE e.V. tried and you got KDE4 |
kb9vqf | that should speak for itself :) |
kb9vqf | I wonder how Qt4/Qt5 will even perform under Wayland |
kb9vqf | There is too much change right now in Linux; AFAIK a lot of companies are rightfully concerned about using Linux vs. more stable alternatives |
simcop2387 | i played with it a bit but nothing serious, that was a while ago |
kb9vqf | honestly Wayland must provide an X11 compat API in order for it to succeed |
simcop2387 | wayland itself seemed to be faster on the open source drivers than Xorg was, which was a good thing, but it was way to slow at the time. |
simcop2387 | it already has that |
kb9vqf | and we can always latch onto that :) |
kb9vqf | If you want bling keep KDE4 and friends |
simcop2387 | that's the whole reason someone made it |
kb9vqf | bling and productivity do not go together really |
kb9vqf | IMNSHO :) |
simcop2387 | yea i've usually got 90% of it turned off, but things like yakuake do help :) |
kb9vqf | yep |
kb9vqf | transparent Konsole windows and a handful of other enahcements :) |
kb9vqf | *enhancements |
kb9vqf | oh, and if you want to prove Qt4's inferiority for certain workloads, just try to access your KDE4 session via VNC/RDP/etc. |
kb9vqf | you can't |
kb9vqf | not in real time |
kb9vqf | more like a bad slideshow |
simcop2387 | which vnc server? with x11vnc it works fine for me, but i'm not 100% sure that counts |
kb9vqf | huh |
kb9vqf | used to be quite bad |
kb9vqf | is that on a LAN? |
simcop2387 | 802.11g |
kb9vqf | over the Internet AFAIK you can forget it |
kb9vqf | maybe they finally fixed that then |
kb9vqf | it took long enough |
simcop2387 | yea |
kb9vqf | well, we're just one alternative of many--pick and choose what you like :) |
kb9vqf | the general UI of Trinity is not going to change |
kb9vqf | and I am not sure that a Qt4 port is even going to be usable |
kb9vqf | last I tried (which was a few months ago) it was horridly slow |
kb9vqf | this was part of the reason we absorbed Qt3 |
kb9vqf | if it isn't broken.... |
simcop2387 | makes me wonder if it's some oddity in opengl drivers, i've seen them do strange things with x11vnc before |
kb9vqf | anyway I need to go |
simcop2387 | have a good night |
kb9vqf | you too :) |
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tbottu | 10New TDE 3.5 bug 506 filed by ogldelphi@mail.ru. |
tbottu | 04Bug http://bugs.pearsoncomputing.net/show_bug.cgi?id=506 enhancement, P5, ---, kb9vqf, NEW, Move kpdf from xpdf to libpoppler |
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* strangelv worries. He relies rather heavily on kpdf |
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* Xu_R wonders if kpdf will see any performance regression/improvement if moved to libpoppler |
MutantTurkey | I think libpoppler is the answer :P |
Xu_R | :P |
MutantTurkey | well only because it's easy to link to and we don't have to do any work on that actual library |
Xu_R | that does sound easy then. |
MutantTurkey | same as with libwebkit vs khtml |
MutantTurkey | if we use our outdated rendering, it won't continue to recive updates, unlike libpoppler which is continuing to get updates |
MutantTurkey | that is how I see it |
Xu_R | and that's probably a good idea... |
MutantTurkey | yeah |
MutantTurkey | and it has a qt wrapper already |
MutantTurkey | i think kpdf currently just has the xpdf code directory copied into it and thats that |
Xu_R | o. |
MutantTurkey | lol |
MutantTurkey | if I recall correctly |
MutantTurkey | but xpdf is still updated also |
MutantTurkey | last update was 8/16/11 |
MutantTurkey | but I don't think it's an ideal solution copying it in |
Xu_R | I'm not sure which is better in the end... :| and we don't know what breakage new versions might bring |
MutantTurkey | libpoppler at least has a large following and an consistant API |
MutantTurkey | xpdf is not a library. so it's not really the best thing to do. |
Xu_R | oic. |
MutantTurkey | Xu_R: also sorry about saturday. there was a ton of flooding to do |
MutantTurkey | to clean up |
Xu_R | MutantTurkey: np... nobody showed up anyway XD we're going to have to try this again soon. |
Xu_R | MutantTurkey: I have to finish up this packaging anyway. kb9vqf told me he considers my lack of RPM packages to test a blocker... so I've got to hurry ;P |
MutantTurkey | yeah I consider that a major impediment |
MutantTurkey | yeah I consider that a major impediment |
MutantTurkey | someone I saw mentioned that "it's only packaged for ubuntu and debian" which is a major turn off for other distros |
MutantTurkey | so having mre support would be greate |
MutantTurkey | increases user base and legitness |
Xu_R | yea... |
MutantTurkey | Xu_R: close any bugs though? |
Xu_R | haven't had the time to look at the bug list lately |
Xu_R | been rushing to get stuff done in time for next week |
Xu_R | (school starting) |
MutantTurkey | yeah me too... |
MutantTurkey | I still havent gotten books or anything yet xD |
Xu_R | XD |
MutantTurkey | I have tuesdays and thursdays off though |
Xu_R | last minute panic :P |
MutantTurkey | but I work those days anyway... |
Xu_R | well, I have to run. got more stuff to do |
Xu_R | later |
MutantTurkey | okay bud |
MutantTurkey | Seriously ubuntu is pissing me off. Every release they become less standardized |
MutantTurkey | they are leaving the FOSS ecosystem rapidly |
MutantTurkey | for example, Unity is the new interface. that's awesome! but it only compiles with ubuntu because they have 5000 zillion hacks and patches to make it work. |
MutantTurkey | talk about pain in the arse. |
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MutantTurkey | KingSphinx: you asked a question yesterday that went unanswered |
MutantTurkey | you left, and then I looked and knew the answer. |
MutantTurkey | do you recall the question? |
KingSphinx | Um, no, I don't recall asking anything yesterday... most recent question I asked was whether or not TDE will have anything for GTK3 integration or not, and that was a few days ago. |
MutantTurkey | okay |
MutantTurkey | that was it |
MutantTurkey | while GTK3 is out. It is likely to take a few years to get it off the ground. |
MutantTurkey | GTK2 is so firmly implanted and so few applications use GTK3 at this point |
MutantTurkey | so answer |
MutantTurkey | is yes but not yet |
KingSphinx | Ah, okay then |
KingSphinx | Guess it's a good thing that I'm thinking ahead, but yeah... |
KingSphinx | Oh! I think I also asked whether updating to 11.10 would be the same as 10.10 -> 11.04, or if any additional steps would need to be taken (this is, of course, assuming there's no repos for Ocelot by that time) |
KingSphinx | *Trinity repos, should've been clearer |
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MutantTurkey | KingSphinx: sorry I had a meeting |
MutantTurkey | you are always supposed to update to 10.10 -> 11.04 -> 11.10 |
MutantTurkey | I dont think you can skip over one |
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KingSphinx | I know, I meant when 11.10 comes out, assuming there's no Ocelot Trinity packages by that time, will upgrading to Ocelot from Natty leave 3.5.12 intact? |
MutantTurkey | It might not |
MutantTurkey | Ubuntu has been messing around with their paths. I am sure that timothy will provide packages for it though. |
MutantTurkey | kb9vqf: can you speak on this? |
kb9vqf | 3.5.12? not sure |
MutantTurkey | what about from HEAD? |
kb9vqf | new packages will definitely be provided from HEAD |
kb9vqf | we have natty builds from HEAD already, ocelot will be next |
kb9vqf | as a rule I don't build packages for Ubuntu until the first beta release |
kb9vqf | of Ubuntu that is |
kb9vqf | it costs a lot of $$$ to build packages unfortunately |
MutantTurkey | kb9vqf: ? |
kb9vqf | electricity |
MutantTurkey | ah |
KingSphinx | Not even open-source is free :/ |
kb9vqf | free as in freedom, remember :) |
MutantTurkey | not as in free beer. |
MutantTurkey | though that is welcomed |
kb9vqf | right |
kb9vqf | consider that there are over 300 *source* packages that comprise Trinity |
KingSphinx | Though, if I remember correctly, something was mentioned in the logs about OpenSUSE still having 3.5 developers? |
kb9vqf | a full rebuild, even on the build farm, can take a couple of days |
MutantTurkey | KingSphinx: NOT DEVELOPERS. |
MutantTurkey | they are maintainers. |
MutantTurkey | they do no work whatsoever to develop it. |
MutantTurkey | they are content with "leaving it as long as it builds" |
kb9vqf | MutantTurkey is correct |
MutantTurkey | which basically ensures that their kde3 branch is dry rotting away. |
kb9vqf | bit rotting ;-) |
kb9vqf | they tend to use nasty distro-specific hacks to get around build failures |
KingSphinx | Wow, that sucks. |
kb9vqf | yeah |
kb9vqf | but that's all their users want right now |
MutantTurkey | and they are jerks and troll our mailing list |
kb9vqf | careful... |
KingSphinx | Still sounds better than not being able to build at all though (*cough*Fedora*cough*) |
MutantTurkey | :) |
kb9vqf | MutantTurkey: Only one does that |
kb9vqf | be very careful |
MutantTurkey | :) |
MutantTurkey | you are correct I apologize. |
kb9vqf | it's OK :) |
KingSphinx | Hmm... will there ever be a point that TDE will move past the 3.5.x naming or is it "frozen" there? |
kb9vqf | it's frozen until the bugs in the bugtracker are under control |
kb9vqf | 3.6 should be almost completely bug free |
kb9vqf | after all that is one of our selling points--fast and stable |
MutantTurkey | :D |
KingSphinx | because you don't want another KDE 4.0 on your hands... ;) |
kb9vqf | exactly |
kb9vqf | we're being somewhat careful about that :) |
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kb9vqf | we have enterprise users that would be....unhappy if it crashed daily on a "stable" releaes |
KingSphinx | I'd imagine so... |
MutantTurkey | unhappy to say the least |
MutantTurkey | just found out that my bandwidth on my vps isn't even capped |
MutantTurkey | If i run over they just charge me only $1 every 100GB |
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tbottu | 10mutantturkey@gmail.com changed the Component on bug 85 from kdemultimedia to ubuntu. |
tbottu | 04Bug http://bugs.pearsoncomputing.net/show_bug.cgi?id=85 major, P5, ---, kb9vqf, UNCONFIRMED, Kmix for KDE4 conflicts with kmix for KDE3 |
MutantTurkey | kb9vqf: I am closing bug 106 |
tbottu | 04Bug http://bugs.pearsoncomputing.net/show_bug.cgi?id=106 normal, P5, ---, kb9vqf, UNCONFIRMED, Duplicated country choices on first run as user |
MutantTurkey | I checked it, doesn't occur for me |
kb9vqf | ok |
MutantTurkey | mark as RESOLVED:WORKSFORME |
MutantTurkey | or FIXED? |
tbottu | 10mutantturkey@gmail.com changed the Status on bug 106 from UNCONFIRMED to RESOLVED FIXED. |
tbottu | 04Bug http://bugs.pearsoncomputing.net/show_bug.cgi?id=106 normal, P5, ---, kb9vqf, RESOLVED FIXED, Duplicated country choices on first run as user |
kb9vqf | that's fine |
MutantTurkey | bug wrangler turkey |
kb9vqf | in the future WORKSFORME may be better (just FYI) |
MutantTurkey | ok |
MutantTurkey | bug 112 |
tbottu | 04Bug http://bugs.pearsoncomputing.net/show_bug.cgi?id=112 major, P5, ---, kb9vqf, NEW, kubuntu-desktop-kde3 installs konsole from KDE4 instead of konsole-kde3 |
MutantTurkey | I think we can also close |
MutantTurkey | this is from 2009. another person configrmed this does happen. and It doesn't happen for me. |
kb9vqf | ok |
kb9vqf | MutantTurkey: You did install the KDE4 konsole before testing, right? |
kb9vqf | oh wait |
kb9vqf | nevermind |
MutantTurkey | :) |
tbottu | 10mutantturkey@gmail.com changed the Component on bug 112 from other (any) to ubuntu. |
tbottu | 10mutantturkey@gmail.com changed the Status on bug 112 from NEW to RESOLVED FIXED. |
tbottu | 04Bug http://bugs.pearsoncomputing.net/show_bug.cgi?id=112 major, P5, ---, kb9vqf, RESOLVED FIXED, kubuntu-desktop-kde3 installs konsole from KDE4 instead of konsole-kde3 |
MutantTurkey | other way around |
kb9vqf | yep |
MutantTurkey | it would pull in konsole |
MutantTurkey | fixed though |
MutantTurkey | neptunia seemed to report alot of bugs. |
kb9vqf | that's a good thing |
kb9vqf | he was testing Trinity thoroughly |
MutantTurkey | yep |
MutantTurkey | bug 112 seems to be connected |
MutantTurkey | to another bug 113 |
tbottu | 04Bug http://bugs.pearsoncomputing.net/show_bug.cgi?id=113 major, P5, ---, kb9vqf, NEW, If konsole from KDE4 installed along KDE3 packages break out |
MutantTurkey | basically, if Konsole(KDE4) was installed, you can't remove it because ksmserver-kd3 trys to rename /usr/bin/plasma |
kb9vqf | yes |
MutantTurkey | marked as fixed? |
kb9vqf | that is due to a design defect in KDE4 |
MutantTurkey | we install to /opt/ now right? |
kb9vqf | it may not be fixed |
MutantTurkey | I will check |
kb9vqf | it doesn't matter where Trinity is installed to |
MutantTurkey | oh okay |
kb9vqf | basically plasma is an ill behaved little brat and always tries to launch no matter what, execpt in a hand picked set of desktop environments |
kb9vqf | (gnome, xfce, etc. |
MutantTurkey | so unless it is marked to not launch it will? |
kb9vqf | yep |
MutantTurkey | how do you stop it? |
kb9vqf | the only way I was able to fix thta was to redirect plasma to a wrapper script that checks for Trinity before launching the real plasma binary |
kb9vqf | *that |
MutantTurkey | ah |
MutantTurkey | okay I gotta catch the train. |
kb9vqf | the bug is still valid; installation/deinstallation should not be affected by what is installed or not installed |
MutantTurkey | hopefully a few bugs rounded up a day and marked off will help |
kb9vqf | but I don't know if the bug is still present :) |
kb9vqf | ok |
kb9vqf | yes it will |
kb9vqf | eventually though you will have to start actually *fixing* them :) |
MutantTurkey | it wil make clearer which bugs are actually bugs... |
MutantTurkey | I know :D |
MutantTurkey | <excuse about working system> |
kb9vqf | ok |
MutantTurkey | http://www.mutantturkey.com/mirrorlog.html |
MutantTurkey | started pulling from trinitydesktop.org also |
kb9vqf | cool |
MutantTurkey | I need to still setup that script to notify you tgoufg |
MutantTurkey | though' |
MutantTurkey | okay I'm off. will be back a bit later :D |
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tidux | are builds x86-only at this point? |
tidux | I tried adding the repositories to my Sheevaplug running Debian Squeeze armel |
tidux | but APT couldn't find the armel repository |
tidux | for Trinity |
kb9vqf | x86/amd64 |
kb9vqf | I don't have arm builders online right now |
tidux | ah |
kb9vqf | (or even the ability to use them) |
kb9vqf | it's on a to-do list :) |
tidux | sheevaplugs are cheap ($99 plus S+H new) and they run Squeeze great from an SDHC |
tidux | power's not all that great, so I figured Trinity would be a great way to get a decent desktop for VNC |
tidux | as it is, I just use SSH or the serial port |
kb9vqf | Trinity + ARM would be a good mix IMHO :) |
kb9vqf | I just haven't had time to set up the (unfamiliar to me) ARM build ysstem |
kb9vqf | *system |
tidux | kb9vqf: eh, once you install Debian (which can be a headache depending on hardware) it's really no different than x86 |
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tidux | most things "just work" for building from source |
kb9vqf | ok |
kb9vqf | but in my case I have no native ARM CPUs :) |
kb9vqf | so then there's an emulator involved somewhere |
kb9vqf | not to mention the interface to my build system and release manager |
tidux | ah |
tidux | just use basic command-line tools wherever possible and you should be good |
kb9vqf | not that it isn't doable, just that it might take a bit for me to get it all running properly |
kb9vqf | of course :) |
tidux | the nice thing about ARM hardware is you can just leave it on |
tidux | my sheevaplug draws ~6W |
tidux | my Roku box draws ~2W |
tidux | switch one 75-watt light bulb to a CFL and add five ARM servers to your LAN - you'll still come out ahead on power |
kb9vqf | of course they have almost no power available for things like compiling or heavy duty computation... |
kb9vqf | ;-) |
kb9vqf | but for embedded systems they are great |
tidux | kb9vqf: bah, my Sheevaplug has a 1.2GHz CPU and 512MB RAM |
kb9vqf | yeah, and how long will it take you to compile the Linux kernel on that? |
tidux | quicker than my old Athlon XP |
kb9vqf | but still slower than my Opteron class systems |
kb9vqf | :) |
tidux | well yeah |
tidux | I hang out with people who still do software development on an 8088 |
kb9vqf | if they made one with a DVI output or PCI slot it would make a great mythtv frontend |
tidux | so relative to old DOS hardware it's lightspeed |
kb9vqf | yes |
tidux | you don't want a Sheevaplug for MythTV |
tidux | get a Trim Slice FitPC |
tidux | comes with Tegra 2 for a CPU/GPU SoC, and HDMI output |
tidux | or DVI-D |
tidux | I forget which |
kb9vqf | "GPU assisted video playback is not supported yet " |
kb9vqf | personally I prefer a thin client with a PCI/E slot |
* tidux shrugs |
tidux | a Tegra 2 is still pretty powerful |
kb9vqf | not enough for HDTV though :) |
tidux | au contraire |
kb9vqf | anyway, I am pulling this channel off topic |
tidux | the FitPC can do 1080p output |
kb9vqf | you can play 1080p with a Tegra? |
tidux | yeah |
kb9vqf | at 60Hz? |
tidux | http://trimslice.com/web/ |
tidux | ^ detailed specs are there |
kb9vqf | ok, cool |
tidux | anyways, how's Qt4 compatibility going? |
tidux | I'd love to see SMPlayer look native in Trinity |
kb9vqf | read the IRC archive :-P |
tidux | where's that? |
kb9vqf | http://www.trinitydesktop.org/irc/logs.html |
kb9vqf | tidux: Basically, Qt4 is a shifting target, it's slow, it's buggy, and it's a royal pain |
kb9vqf | not sure it's worth the compat layer ATM |
kb9vqf | I am working on other ways to get the Trinity look+feel on Qt4 :) |
kb9vqf | (for native Qt4 apps that is) |
kb9vqf | In some respects, using Qt4 is like asking for a modern native Windows C++ application to be rewritten with an old version of Visual Basic |
tidux | yeah, I don't even use Qt4 apps anymore - the only things on my system that use it are smplayer and VirtualBox |
tidux | and I stopped using VirtualBox in favor of KVM |
tidux | Amarok 2.... WHY. |
kb9vqf | VirtualBox here is the only Qt4 app I use |
kb9vqf | Becuase people are stupid and can't figure out how to use a powerful app like Amarok 1.4? |
tidux | one question: will Trinity support other window managers? |
kb9vqf | for example? |
tidux | I'm one of the 15 or so Window Maker geeks left on the planet |
kb9vqf | ah |
tidux | and I found a KDE3-lookalike theme |
tidux | and a systray dockapp |
kb9vqf | well, it is fully NET compliant |
kb9vqf | so you should be able to use any WM you want |
tidux | heh nice |
kb9vqf | For example I know the compiz WM works |
kb9vqf | just be sure to run it with the --replace option, to replace kwin |
tidux | ah |
kb9vqf | or similar (WM may have a different name for the equivalent option) |
kb9vqf | anyway, I need to get going |
tidux | ok |
kb9vqf | hopefully I will have time to look into ARM builds this year |
tidux | cool |
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MutantTurkey | o/ |
KingSphinx | I made a Kubuntu Hardy live CD just for kicks earlier... it's nice, but it really serves as a point as to how far Linux as a whole has come in just three years... |
MutantTurkey | has it come far? |
KingSphinx | Quite far, actually. Seems that while it did recognize my wireless card needed drivers, my display wouldn't go past 800x600 (it's 1280x1024 native) |
MutantTurkey | true |
MutantTurkey | our autodetect is getting more magical |
KingSphinx | Not to mention it felt a bit sluggish even for being on a CD |
MutantTurkey | I think the ecosystem is only getting slower though :| |
KingSphinx | Trinity or Linux in general? |
KingSphinx | Though one notable difference between Hardy and Kubuntu/Trinity is that Hardy included Dolphin as the default file browser... I honestly didn't know there even was a version of Dolphin for KDE3 O_o |
MutantTurkey | linux |
MutantTurkey | trinity remains fast |
KingSphinx | Well, it can't be blazing-fast all the time... no matter how much we all wish it could be, the ecosystem has to slow down sometimes. Don't give up hope though, the Linux community will speed up again soon. |
KingSphinx | Heck, we just had GNOME 3 not too long ago |
KingSphinx | Keep in mind that the last time we had a real "new" GNOME was ten years ago... |
KingSphinx | I think the next time we'll see a major pickup in the community is when KDE 5 is released. Even though I love Trinity, I'm honestly excited to see what KDE 5 will bring. |
MutantTurkey | meh |
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Qu4Z | I'm hoping KDE5 will be cool, but KDE seems to have moved to inhabit the slot that Gnome used to serve, with Gnome moving off into tabled territory |
KingSphinx | And I think that Trinity could serve as a decent alternative for users spurned away by GNOME's radical shift |
KingSphinx | Easy on resources, stable, offers good integration (not perfect, but eh) with GTK2 apps... |
* KingSphinx feels like a salesperson in an infomercial... >_>; |
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Qu4Z | I think Trinity could offer a decent alternative for any users :) |
Qu4Z | ... except users of Trinity, of course. That wouldn't make sense |
Qu4Z | And probably tiling window managers. They're too cool for us |
KingSphinx | I never quite understood tiling window managers. I mean, why go backwards in time technology-wise? (...yes, I realize I'm saying this while using what's technically an "outdated" DE) |
KingSphinx | Wasn't Windows 1.0 the only version to do tiling? |
Qu4Z | Well, some people even type source code into a text editor instead of dragging and connecting components like has been possible for years. There's no accounting for taste, I guess. |
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tbottu | 10New TDE 3.5 bug 507 filed by m.f.janfranke@web.de. |
tbottu | 04Bug http://bugs.pearsoncomputing.net/show_bug.cgi?id=507 enhancement, P5, ---, kb9vqf, NEW, root-pw not accepted in [Alt]+[F2] |
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KingSphinx | Whee, earthquakes. |
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MutantTurkey | o/ |
MutantTurkey | hmmm |
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calvin | o/ |
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Qu4Z | Anyone knowledgable around? I'm trying to build trinity on gentoo (there's no overlay or anything yet, as far as I know). |
Qu4Z | I assume it has to be built against qt3, and the qt3support from qt4 doesn't cut it (or at least the patch doesn't apply) |
Qu4Z | => is there a pre-patched qt3 tarball around for download somewhere? |
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calvin | Qu4Z: ? |
calvin | you need to build our qt3 |
calvin | which is in our git repository |
calvin | http://git.trinitydesktop.org |
calvin | (sorry everyone is sleeping) |
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MutantTu1key | finally emptied my inbox of 4000 messages... |
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MutantTu1key | kb9vqf: where are the channel logs? |
MutantTu1key | also, I see you've been doing krandr work, anything worth mentioning? |
kb9vqf | http://trinity.pearsoncomputing.net/irc/logs.html |
kb9vqf | yes, some cool stuff is now available |
kb9vqf | screenshots forthcoming after builds are finished |
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KingSphinx | Assuming the work on porting Qt3 to TQt is complete, do you think that TDE could be added to Ubuntu's official repos anytime soon? Or do they not want such an "outdated" desktop? |
MutantTu1key | [Cit is |
MutantTu1key | sorry |
MutantTu1key | KingSphinx: I think there will be a greater chance once we release and have a larger following |
MutantTu1key | I mean, repo's work on demand. if people want a program, its more likely to end up in the offical repos |
KingSphinx | So it's just a "wait-and-see" thing? |
MutantTu1key | frankly I would rather stay seperate, because that wayyou have more control |
MutantTu1key | Tim was the kubuntu packager for some time so he is more familiar with it than I am though |
* KingSphinx is busy fixing some "broken" KDM themes |
MutantTu1key | for kde3? |
KingSphinx | Yep, the Kubuntu O2 theme points to a non-existant wallpaper, so I just had to edit kubuntu.xml to point to the right wallpaper |
KingSphinx | Not that hard, really. |
MutantTu1key | send that off to timothy |
KingSphinx | Though I have yet to see if it actually worked or not... >_>; |
MutantTu1key | ._. |
KingSphinx | Might as well see if it did, brb |
MutantTu1key | well if it works, send it off to the ML. |
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KingSphinx | It worked! |
KingSphinx | Now I just have to see if the userlist variant has this same problem |
MutantTu1key | good stuff |
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tbottu | 10mutantturkey@gmail.com changed the Component on bug 507 from other (any) to kdebase. |
tbottu | 04Bug http://bugs.pearsoncomputing.net/show_bug.cgi?id=507 enhancement, P5, ---, kb9vqf, NEW, root-pw not accepted in [Alt]+[F2] |
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MutantTu1key | connection problems? |
KingSphinx | No, just have to log out to see if my fix worked. Also, the userlist variant is bug-free since it points to the default KDM background. |
* KingSphinx actually feels useful for once, even if it was a minor bug :D |
kb9vqf | MutantTurkey: http://www.trinitydesktop.org/secret_whispers_0f_a_n3w_p0w3r.png |
KingSphinx | :o A new KRandR? |
kb9vqf | A better one |
kb9vqf | it's not a replacement for the tray icon |
kb9vqf | this one configures the entire system from KDM startup onwards |
kb9vqf | it supports extended, not just cloned, desktops |
kb9vqf | and it can apply the settings on the fly :) |
MutantTu1key | thats awesome |
kb9vqf | I think this puts us on the forefront of usability...no more Xorg files :)) |
MutantTu1key | I mean that is a seriously awesome improvement. |
MutantTu1key | GO TIM! WOOOT WOOT. IT'S YOUR BIRTHDAY. LETS PARTY! /o/ \o/ \o\ |
kb9vqf | IIRC KDE4 can't do that either |
kb9vqf | or gnome |
kb9vqf | especially not the arbitrary monitor config |
KingSphinx | I was just about to ask that |
MutantTu1key | gnome has a terrible montor config. |
KingSphinx | Especially now with GNOME 3 |
MutantTu1key | good randr support is important to alot of users. |
* KingSphinx speaks from experience |
MutantTu1key | especially power users. |
kb9vqf | When I was testing this I was just having fun dragging my secondary monitor wherever I wanted it :) |
kb9vqf | up, down, side to side... |
MutantTu1key | kb9vqf: can you switch primary monitors? |
kb9vqf | yes |
MutantTu1key | bam. |
kb9vqf | see the primary monitor checkbbox? |
KingSphinx | I mean, I don't have dual-monitors (desk is way too small), but this is still awesome to have. |
MutantTu1key | kb9vqf: haven't checked yet. |
kb9vqf | I meant in the screenshot |
MutantTu1key | oh i see the link now |
MutantTu1key | http://www.trinitydesktop.org/secret_whispers_0f_a_n3w_p0w3r.png |
KingSphinx | And yet more proof that "old" KDE is FAR from dead. |
MutantTu1key | secret whispers of a new power.... |
MutantTu1key | in the screenshot I am only seeing one monitor |
kb9vqf | that's because I only had one connected when I took it :-P |
MutantTu1key | oh okay |
kb9vqf | more monitors show up, trust me :) |
MutantTu1key | I have a buddy like in the cubicle next to me using kde4. |
MutantTu1key | I am going to ask him about his randr setup ina minute |
KingSphinx | This is planned for the 3.5.13 release? |
kb9vqf | yes |
kb9vqf | it's in SVN and active |
MutantTu1key | KingSphinx:... it is live. |
|
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